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Haas: Dangerous Sainz ‘needs glasses’ after F1 Canadian GP crash
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Posted By: Editor   |  14 Jun 2017   |  4:04 pm GMT  |  97 comments

Haas Team Principal Guenther Steiner criticised Toro Rosso’s Carlos Sainz Jr for causing a crash at the Formula 1 Canadian Grand Prix, deeming his punishment insufficient.

The outfit picked up its first double-points finish of 2017 in Monaco, but Romain Grosjean was its highest finisher at Montreal in 10th while team-mate Kevin Magnussen finished 12th having picked up a time penalty for overtaking Stoffel Vandoorne under the Virtual Safety Car.

Sainz has been handed a three-place grid penalty for the Azerbaijan Grand Prix after cutting off Grosjean and careering backwards into Felipe Massa into the Turn 3/4 chicane on the opening lap.

Grosjean called it a “very, very dangerous manoeuvre” with Williams’ Massa saying, “I was a complete passenger in the collision.”

The stewards handed Sainz a penalty for the race at Baku on June 25 as his lack of acknowledgement of the car in his blind-spot was deemed to be “careless and potentially dangerous.

“This was evidenced by the further collision of Car 8 [Grosjean] with Car 19 [Massa], a direct result of this incident, which caused the retirement of Car 19.

“The driver of car 55 [Sainz] claimed he checked his mirrors but that car 8 was in his blind spot and therefore he did not see it,” concluded the stewards, who also put two penalty points on his licence with a total of seven in the last 12 months.

“The punishment is too low,” said Steiner to Auto Motor und Sport.

“Grosjean had a full race ban after Spa in 2012 for ignoring other cars in his blind spot.”

Sainz blamed the lack of visibility in his mirrors in a post-race interview and apologised for causing the crash.

“All of a sudden, I touched with a Haas that was on my right-hand side,” said Sainz.

“I have to say I never saw the car there, it’s simply a dead angle in my mirrors so I never knew he was there.

“If I had realised he was there, of course I would’ve been more careful and left some space.

“Once we collided I was just a passenger, crashed into the wall and that was the end of my race unfortunately. I’d like to say sorry, especially to Felipe, who received a touch from me.”

But Haas boss Steiner classed the Toro Rosso driver as a repeat offender, refusing to accept his excuse due to previous crashes in Sainz’s career.

“[Sainz also] pushed Magnussen off the track in the exit of the pit lane at Barcelona,” Steiner explained.

“And, he messed up practice in Montreal because he did not look in the mirrors.

He added, “Either he needs glasses or larger mirrors.”

Have your say in the comment section below or on JA on F1’s Facebook Page.

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97 comments

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1

“Either he needs glasses or larger mirrors.”

It wouldn't be a bad idea to require slightly larger mirrors. Obviously, this would impede airflow, but it might be worth it if this improves rear visibility for the drivers.

What I would really like to see at some point in F1 are rear view cameras as this would help deal with any blind spots. For such a technologically sophisticated sport, F1 often feels behind the times.

2

what cant f1 cars have proximity sensors to detect cars that are close - for that matter why dont all new cars have it, blind sports should be a thing of the past.

3
devilsadvocate

Maybe that's a good idea for a penalty? You turn in on, squeeze, or otherwise crash into someone due to "not being able to see them"? Install some bus mirrors on the car for the next race.

4

Punishment to fit the crime. I like it. Failing to observe blue flags could incur a similar penalty.

I'm sure there are more possibilities. Release the car from a pitstop without a wheel attached? Next race the pit crew tightens the nuts with wheel braces instead of rattle guns. Speeding in the pit lane or dangerous driving? Next race the driver's mum replaces the race engineer on the team radio. Etc., etc....

5

I'm surprised he only got 2 penalty points for that. Out of 2 and down to 3, he swerved over not once but twice on Grosjean ... how could he think that no one was beside him? He should've driven straight towards 3, then take a wider line in. After that, from 4 down to 6, the cars usually go into single file.

Steiner is correct that Sainz was dangerous in free practice, and in taking to the grass to try to pass Magnussen out of the pit exit at Barcelona ... two fairly boneheaded moves. He's only 5 pts from a race ban ... he needs to smarten up, and calm down a bit.

6
Tornillo Amarillo

Sainz also torpedoed Stroll at Bahrain and Sainz got the penalty.

7

i think it's all a bit of a beat up.. a bit careless but I think he'd be more concerned at the DNF than a couple of demerit points.
Let's not be too precious about it all.
At least he admitted that he stuffed up. A first for F1 ?

8

Exactly - wasn't it Grosjean himself who everyone criticised on his debut with a spate of accidents? Short memories - Haas needs a little perspective.

9

this is the same guy who crashed into Stroll and said that Stroll is a rookie and that he should pay more attention to the cars around him.
what a tool.

10

hes no tool. He's frustrated at best. The only tool at that race was Danny Sullivan.

11

Why's that? That was Sainz's fault, dive-bombing into turn 1 and then expecting to be seen. Brundle I recall also placed the blame squarely on Carlos then.

12

Wow, drama queen? Yes it was completely Sainz’s fault, but there have been worse accidents like that in the past. Grosjean was having starts like that every other race in 2012, so for him to take the high ground is a bit rich. Added to that, Sainz had the decency to apologize immediately after the accident – he didn’t try to hide from the blame or blame anyone else, which is more that can be said for about half the field.
Not sure what the relevance of Spain is. Sainz got a bit happy on the pit exit, but Magnussen kept the place and was on his way, and it was really Sainz who was worse off and looked a bit foolish...why even bring that up?

13

I had forgotten about the pit lane nonsense in Barcelona, Carlos is a good driver but he needs to calm down a bit.

14

I think Carlos and Sergio are beginning to feel the heat. Given the turmoil going on at Mclaren, given the unhappiness coming out of Red Bull, they are aware that several drivers might be changing seats. I think a few races ago they were at the head of the pick....but now it might be possible, I guess its open knowledge that Alonso is available for any team should they want. I think that puts Kimi out there as available also. Ocon is slowly but surely making a better impression race by race. So now if Carlos or Sergio want a change, they might not be at the head of the field. They've both started making mistakes, we've seen it on more than one occasion for both. They really need to calm down.

15

Another doubtful Stewardship decision was not punishing Lewis for receiving a foreign object from a third party {marshal} before the FiA final inspection.
As in Ferrari Schumi times, Merc-Lew-Lew could have raced underweight and then receive a ballast hidden inside some object {flag / pole} and place in the car, making it compliant.
Of course it is a hard decision to make, but the DTM already DQF a race winner last year when somebody tossed a water botle towards him.
Watch the images from FiA YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0-ECT4k9FQ&t=34s

16

This article is about Sainz. It is a Lewis-free zone. Please keep your Lewis comments to Lewis related articles.

17

Obviously The Editor found it a proper place.
FiA's Governance non Compliance fail subject too.

18

I guess the DTM incident you're thinking of must be Ekstrom in 2013. That was rather more than someone throwing a water bottle towards him. His father emptied a bottle of water into the pocket of his race suit.

19

you would think with the coverage afforded these days that a stewards room would be able to oversee a flag handover and observe if it breaks any rules or not

like come come on man, it's 2017

20

Good point. Ayrton Senna had to stop receiving flags during his victories due to regulations. Because of that, he always had a Brazilian flag in the cockpit.

21

Wow. You really know how to suck the joy out of a celebration!

22

So I guess we'll call it even, between this and what Vettel did with lining up outside of his grid slot in China?

Things are getting pretty petty of late.

23

Vettel didn't act outside the regulations in China. He was simply smarter than everyone else to use the regulation to his benefit.

24

Sure he did. It's just that first Whiting and the stewards in China weren't willing to bring the hammer down:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-drivers-warned-over-grid-positions-after-vettel-incident-894102/

Whiting could see that Vettel was out of position and could have aborted the start, which would have seen the German forced to start from the pitlane.

But instead Whiting opted to give Vettel the benefit of the doubt and referred the matter to the stewards, who then made the call that there would be no penalty.

However, since China, the FIA has reviewed the situation - and in a group call with all the FIA stewards this week it was decided that a repeat would probably result in a sanction, something the drivers have now been informed of.

No rules or regulations have since changed, but drivers know now that a repeat will likely garner a penalty.

25

Whiting could have aborted the start, but he didn't. The reason the stewards weren't willing to put the hammer down was because the regulation is written poorly and is open to interpretation.
Ricciardo did the same thing in Japan last year and, neither was the start aborted or did Ricciardo get a penalty, for the sole reason that the regulation is in a grey area. Whiting even told drivers in the driver's conference in Austin, the next race 'to use common sense'- not that it explicitly couldn't be done in future races. You can't penalise a driver for a poorly worded regulation. If it didn't contravene any regulation, it must by definition be legal. Vettel was just more clued in, as was Ricciardo last year.

26

...and any penalty given like that would only confirm what a load of boswulox most rules are. Waaay too much red tape these days.

27

Dweberis, nice try, but flagpole?!

28
Torchwood Mobile

Other F1 race winners have received flags before; why you picking on Lewis?

29

We all know how heavy that Union Jack is....what is it 3 or 4 flags in one? Plus its' laden with the Empires notorious deeds in history...:)

30

Because there is a special extra rules section that only applies to Lewis, don't ya know?

31

called superior driving skills..

32

because he behaves like the rules don't apply to him

33

he's too good to be stopped by regulation..

34

Last year Sainz was impressive however he is not doing his chances of a top team this year any good this year. he has been careless and Kvyat has been there or there about with him.

35

Are you having a laugh?! Sainz has been very good this season.

36
Clarks4WheelDrift

There or there abouts?!?

Sainz 5, Kvyat 2 in qually, same as Seb to Kimi.

37

Sainz 4, Kvyat 3
Seb 6, Kimi 1

38

Would be interesting to know why MV, the #2 Red Bull driver gets away with cutting across the path of SV at the start? No one was put into the barriers, but the Ferrari's race was severely compromised as a result.

Seems "we have a failure of consistency" here, to paraphrase the famous line from the iconic movie.

39

Why did Max make suck a cracking start? Did he jump the start? Who knows? We didn't get to see the replays until about 25 mins into the race, even nothing during the safety car?
Yet another abismal job of directing the telecast... missed pit stops, jumping from one car to the teammate car instead of following the first one right around the lap, missed overtakes! pathetic ... Liberty, are you reading this?

40

because, MV is a cat with 90 lives, a smart cat. He has gotten away with more than most other drivers combined in the last 2 years 🙂

41

it's a racing incident
come on man 1+1=2, very clean logic at work here

42

Just look good at the pictures.. even Vettel agreed there was nothing wrong. Het left "the door open" and VER used it. If any blame it would have been Bottas.

43

@Garrett Bruce. Because Vettel was not taking the normal path through the corner and MV was clearly in front long before the turn?

Did Vettel get punished for the Spa 2016 start?

44

Maybe because MV knows how to use his mirrors and SV was only focussed on Valterri 'lock-up' Bottas he didn't see MV (sounds familiar as Sainz didn't see Grosjean), in case you want to blame same it is SV for not seeing MV but as it all happens in a split second on the first lap we call it a racing incident.

Now do you want some fresh frontwings with those tears?

45
Stephen Taylor

Sorry Garett Bruce the Verstappen thing was clearly a racing incident maybe it was a very aggressive. I don't no why you refer to Max as the number 2 RBR driver where . It's not like Ferrari where there is clear gap in performance between Seb and Kimi. In fact Verstappen has been let down by his car in Bahrain and Canada and also his strategy in Monaco but for that Max would be in front. Max has also out qualified DR the last few races

46

who knows. may be Max cannot handle the machinery. puts too much stress and ends up with a failure. on the other hand, Danny is driving within the limitations and getting podium after podium.

47

@abhijith,
Remotely possible as an explanation at first glance, but after 10 laps? Get real. The brake-related DNF was also early in the race, not Alonso-ishly late.

48

Yep maybe he needs a pair of glasses.
The zig zagging really didn't for him any favours on a tight track. For a class driver in he has shown a few moments of utter madness.
Maybe next time he'll have his normal head on his shoulders.

49

James, this collection of quotes is a few days late, no? What's your analysis of the situation? I'd say sainz should get a bigger penalty AND maybe the FIA should look into the Torro Rosso mirror situation. Pretty ridiculous for a veteran of the sport to use a blind spot as an excuse.

50

f1 cars have no rear view mirror, only side mirrors, so yes there are blind spots, they don't matter when actually racing but can matter in traffic

regardless sainz was reckless here, the punishment fits the crime

51

all this hybrid technology requiring an engine to be categorized as 5 distinct components require rocket scientist education and F1 can't solve the blind spot issue with even a dollar store quality convex mirror #irony

52

6 distinct categories, but who's counting? 😃

Would seem like a great opportunity to develop the collision avoidance systems seen on newer road cars.

53

I've been wondering for years why the FIA don't have much tougher rules around wing mirrors.

54

Grosjeans Spa 2012 faux pas was one of many hence his one race ban. Sainz's mistake was a rarity. Haas need to cool it

55

What does HAAS want Sainz to do? Get on his knees and please for forgiveness? They're dragging this whole incident way too long. They need to probably focus more on sorting out their performance issues.

56

We hear a lot about blind spots in mirrors. Surely the simple solution is to force the teams to fit mirrors that can see all areas. Not exactly expensive is it.

57
Tornillo Amarillo

“This was evidenced by the further collision of Car 8 [Grosjean] with Car 19 [Massa], a direct result of this incident, which caused the retirement of Car 19.

What ?

58

Substitute Car 55 for Car 8.

Loved Grosjean's radio on it: "What a mental guy!! What was that?! What a mental guy!!!"

59
Tornillo Amarillo

I said it yesterday, what happens with Sainz, Perez, Kvyat, KMag... too much presure and a explosive situation in F1. Everybody has to calm down.
Clearly it's a PRESSURE COOKER the situation in Toro Rosso-Red Bull:
- Sainz was delayed in TR when Max got the Kvyat seat;
- Max and Ric are confirmed in RB for 2018
- Ric is smarter : 3 podiums in a row now
- Sainz was getting problems in TR with combinations on track with Kvyat;
- But RB are not good enough since the Renault PU is not getting major upgrades...
- Max says this year -and next- is crap...

Sainz is in a bad position, bad at TR, bad waiting for a seat in an uncompetitive RB, and bad because he has no seat at RB.

To free this pressure cooker,... RB has to relieve Sainz from its contract, so Sainz can go to Renault, Ferrari, Williams, McLaren (if Alonso leaves) or Force India (if one of the drivers moves).
Sainz is getting crazy and he doesn't deserves that. Meanwhile, calm down Carlitos.

60

@Tornillo,
Well at least thanks this time you dropped Max in your first sentence.

61
Tornillo Amarillo

Max is pushing the whole team, he makes mistakes, but it's ok, it's fun, only problem Ric is making podiums every race ! Fix that Max and beat Ric from time to time!

62

"... Kevin Magnussen finished 12th having picked up a time penalty for overtaking Stoffel Vandoorne under the Virtual Safety Car."

Hardly seems fair to be penalized for passing a Honda engine, VSC or not.

63
Clarks4WheelDrift

Steiner needs to zip it with the excuses and concentrate on their poor car. Step 1 try and get the brakes working properly for Grosjean, after all this time.

Why was Magnussen so slow at the pit exit Gunthy mi lad? Why was the HASS pit stop slower than the Torro Rosso? Sainz had to lift, another tenth and it definitely would have been an unsafe release.

64

New penalty: Larger mirrors to be implemented for transgressions of this nature to impede aerodynamics for the next 5 races. Too many penalties and the car will look like Mickey Mouse!

65

Last year he did the same to Alonso in Mexico.

66

Isn't he the chap that got ditched by the main red bull team for crashing into Sebastian vettel twice in one lap!
That said there is clearly issues between the two toro rosso drivers and Saintz is the better driver of the two,however he also was at fault here,no question.
The knock on effect was major,especially for Felipe and it could have been even more serious.

67

Not a good piece of driving from Sainz. A 3 place penalty is quite lenient for needlessly wrecking the entire race of 2 of your fellow drivers, considering you can get thrown to the back of the grid just for changing a couple of parts of your engine. Between this incident and ramming Stroll in Bahrain, he needs to make sure that he doesn't develop a reputation for recklessness. He's not a rookie any more, so let's hope that he learn the lessons quickly.

68

Claimed he checked his mirrors

But he doesn't say if he indicated? Sainz needs to brush up on his Highway Code again😊

69

You beat me to it JK! 🙂

70

they should dump Sainz and get Alonzo he would have a better chance with Haas right now

71

Sure Sainz squeezed him the first time but the contact came from Grosjean coming back on. Watch the view from the air and watch twice. The first time just watch Sainz. The second time just watch Grosjean. When the contact is made Grosjean has more than a cars width. Hell the first squeezed left him with just a cars width. The top drivers would not have crashed in this situation like Grosjean did.

72

You can't be serious. Grosjean went onto the grass from the first squeeze, then he gets back on track and there's Carlos coming back over again!

If Carlos knows he has a blind spot to his right, and he can't be 100% sure that no one is in there, then don't weave or swerve towards that area. Pretty simple.

He would know (or should've known) that he would be ahead of anyone in his blind spot into turns 3-4, and then they would have to file in behind.

73

since hamilton explained how to negotiate the last chicane in canada, hardly anyone's been in the wall of champions. i remember him saying "you take a lot of curb on the first corner and miss the second curb entirely".
thanks to the genius, that wall of champions has been made redundant..

74

I think Hamilton invented the fidget spinner as well. There ain't nothin' that boy can't do!

75

catherine hettinger, a chemical engineer by training, was initially credited by some news stories to have been the inventor of the fidget spinner, including by the media outlets such as the guardian, the new york times, and the new york post. hettinger filed a patent application for a "spinning toy" in 1993.
it's normal to respect multiple f1 champions..

76

Or, possibly, that the wall has been moved further away from the track this year.....

77

no one has been in that wall since....

78

no, the wall has not been moved back..hamilton did add that if you hit the second curb, you would hit the wall.

79

Thank you for your correction regarding the position of the wall.

You might want to pass that on to the Sky F1 commentary team, who were discussing the subject in FP1 and various other F1 web-sites (yes, they exist !) who reported the track changes a short while ago.

As I understand it, the wall has been angled away from the track so it 'opens up' on exit, i.e. is moved back from its previous position.

However, we could all be mistaken.

80

here you go, enjoy watching this and you will notice that each driver who crashed into the wall went over the second curb. ever since hamilton explained that you should go over the first curb and miss the second, everyone knows how to avoid it..

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IvUlCm98LNs

81

there are youtube footages of all those who crashed into that wall still available for your reference.
the tyre wall is in exactly the same position the concrete wall was. there is a concrete wall behind the tyre wall mind you..

82

all those drivers who collided with that wall did so because they hadn't yet learned from hamilton, how negotiate it..

83

am confident that the position of the wall is exactly as it has always been...just that it is no longer a concrete wall but a tyre wall with a concrete wall behind it and it is not the change in material which has kept drivers from colliding into it. the point of discussion is that drivers have not collided with that wall since hamilton made a clear explaination of how to avoid hitting the wall..you claimed it may be because the wall has been moved back but i can assure you that the distance from the chicane to the tyre wall surface hasn't changed. i can see all this on my tv, no need for anyone from sky telling me..

84

Silly me, I should not have believed what I heard, saw and read. Thank you for clarifying the issue.

85

the same sky commentator has lied to you for years that alonso was the most complete f1 driver and yet we witness season in season out that he is the worst at choosing which team to drive for.. we have also witnessed that he isn't that good in the wet or qualifying he's not the best at overtaking or defending as we have seen him unable to pass a rookie in the same car...so what exactly makes him "the most complete"? you're better off using your own eyes..

87

is carlos sainz not a double world rallying champion?

88
Tornillo Amarillo

His dad (?)

89

yes senior, meaning he has inherited genes with the tendency to drift.

90

You have dozens of facts & outbursts to bring a yellow headline for Hammy but you are focused on the "others". This is a lobby, a powerful lobby in F1.

91

If you fit parking sensors to a Fiat Panda, why are there no proximity sensors on F1 cars? Ok, so the steering wheel screen is already full of information, and the drivers already hear a beep in their ear when it's time to shift gear, but surely the best engineers in the world could develop a means to communicate proximity of other cars to their drivers...

92

There have been an increased number of these type of shunts since the FIA raised the surround of the cockpit. F1 tech regs define the size of mirrors and no team is going to make them larger unless forced to. I'd tell Steiner to hold his putdowns until he has driven a current f1 car and been in the same situation.

93
Tornillo Amarillo

In summary: No Red Bull, Sainz has got "Red Balls"...

94

This is an example where a team would benefit from Indy-style spotters. Some of the IndyCar teams do have them on road courses at critical points of the track. Is there anything in the rules that would prevent a team from deploying them if they felt it would be helpful? It would seem it's not "advising" a driver on how to drive the car, simply stating race conditions.

95

Amazing.. first time Mr Crashy Grosjean has been in a crash that wasnt his fault.

96

Blind spot, blind spot... Why have blind spots at all? There ought to be a way to allow drivers to see, or to detect, what's behind them and beside them. Road cars have this technology do they not?

97

If I recall correctly; by this stage in his career Grosjean definitely had a few more tangles than Sainz has. Perhaps that is why Grosjean got banned, not for the single accident that Steiner is referring to.

I am not picking on Grosjean, I actually think he has come on strides since then; just stating the facts.

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