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Felipe Massa “so disappointed” with “dangerous” Perez after Montreal shunt
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Posted By: James Allen  |  09 Jun 2014   |  2:48 am GMT  |  161 comments

Felipe Massa was released from Sacre Coeur hospital following precautionary checks after his 180mph accident with Sergio Perez, which sent the Brazilian into the barriers in a 32g impact.

And after leaving he described the man with whom he collided as “dangerous”.

Massa was making up lost ground after a slow first stop had cost him track positions; he was ahead of eventual winner Daniel Ricciardo in the opening stint. On the final lap, he went to pass Perez on the inside into Turn 1; Perez was suffering with issues on the ERS and with braking, as well as nursing tyres that were 36 laps old.

Perez came across to the left slightly and his left rear wheel tagged Massa’s front right, sending both spinning into the barriers.

XPB.cc
“We are doing around 300km/h there. With another car in front (Sebastian Vettel’s) it could have been a very serious accident.

“We’ve had the rules for a few years that when one car is up the side the other cannot move anymore. He just moved and we touched.

“It’s dangerous. For me five places is not enough. He was dangerous. We could have crashed into Vettel.”I talked to him at the medical centre. I was so disappointed with him.

“I said that he needs to learn. I wanted him to put himself in my place, because I had a huge crash and honestly I thought it was going to hurt.

“It’s not the first time that he turned into somebody under braking. He did this many times. He didn’t say anything, he just turned and left. I hope he learns.

Vettel, who was third on the road ahead of the Perez/Massa battle, said he saw a white flash as Massa’s car passed a few metres in front of him. The German was extremely fortunate not to have been side swiped by Massa’s out of control car travelling at over 150mph.

“Into Turn One I saw they were very close to each other and I saw something white coming in the mirror and at the last second I reacted and opened the car, basically turned right and Felipe was in the air flying past, ” said Vettel. “Kind of surreal but quite lucky that he didn’t hit me in that instance and I saw him just in time.”

Perez issued a robust denial on Monday,

“It was very disappointing to lose such a strong result through no fault of our own. I was following the same line and braking patterns as in the previous laps and I just got hit from behind by Massa. There was plenty of space on the left of my car to attempt a clean overtake and I cannot understand why he had to scrape by.

“I watched several replays of the incident and I can’t help but notice how Felipe turns right just before he hits me. I can only think he must have changed his mind and wanted to rejoin the racing line, his misjudgement cost us a big amount of points.

“Also, I’m not happy about comments saying we should have retired the car. It was perfectly driveable with just some adjustments and we showed it up until the moment in which we were taken out. Other cars out there had been in similar conditions for way longer than us and they finished the race without problems.

“If someone thinks you can keep two Red Bulls behind for as long as we did with so-called ‘terminal’ problems, they are clearly misguided.”

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161 Comments
  1. Kris Sharp says:

    I have to disagree with Massa. He was too optimistic about that overtake attempt. From Perez onboard camera it’s visible that his steering movement was quite small.

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    1. Kevin shiel says:

      Agree, i honestly thought it was massa’s fault for going into a gap that didnt really existed given that he was only 2 laps from finishing with good points. I would have a serious talk with massa if i was the team priciple

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    2. Satish says:

      Massa says that Perez never learns. Well, Massa himself never learns that he has a choice to crash and blame the other person or overtake cleanly. Vettel, Alonso, Kimi, Button are all in the 2nd category.

      Alas, Massa prefers to always stick his head in the sand and cry foul.

      Reminds me of his crash with Coulthard in Australia 2008. DC said “Felipe is not racing me for the World Championship so he can do the same manoeuvre for the next 17 grands prix and it will be the same result”.

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    3. Peter Freeman says:

      I am disappointed with the stewards. This was not a small incident, two drivers had to go to the hospital and it very nearly could have been three drivers in the hospital! So either this is a racing incident or it was an extremely dangerous move by one or the other of the drivers. If Perez is at fault then the penalty does not fit the crime and the ARE penalty options available to the stewards that would fit this crime.

      Does someone have to die or what are they waiting for before saying NO this is not acceptable?

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    4. cLARKS4wHEELdRiFT says:

      Massa is totally correct here, Checo was bang out of order. Moving over on Massa at the exact point Massa had just committed and pulled out of his slipstream.

      The penalty should be a lot harsher due to just how dangerous it was. Checo has history doing this and I imagine there would be uproar if he’d put Seb, Lewis or Fernando into the wall.

      Checo was no doubt annoyed Seb finally passed him and is clearly watching Massa in his left mirror in the run down to turn 1. On the run up to the left hander turn 1, there’s a right hand kink so Massa and Checo are both turning slightly right and Checo has less than a cars width to his right. As soon as Massa commits Checo moves left and takes him out at full speed, there’s clearly now at least a couple of car widths on the track to the right of Checo when they touch.

      The in car from Massa didn’t really seem to show the frames smoothly but it’s clear from the start of this overhead clip,
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BObcBrAe-ro&feature=player_detailpage

      Couple that with the Williams data and he’s bang to rights. Whether he is trying to deliberately get Massa to jink further left, or whether he thought he was doing it early enough to force Massa to lift doesn’t matter as it’s a dangerous move entering the braking zone and all three drivers were lucky.

      Massa’s racecraft against Seb is another matter completely, it didn’t seem too good with his better tyres but then again look how tough it was for anyone trying to pass the one stopping Force Indias.

      The penalty should be a slap in the face from Montoya. 😉

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    5. Dan says:

      I agree, Massa made a last gasp attempt to pass. He wasn’t ‘alongside’ as Massa claims or the wheels would never have connected the way they did.

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    6. Nevans says:

      Then check out this multi-image photo showing the lines taken by Massa, Perez and Vettel. http://i.imgur.com/WRTu05L.jpg

      It clearly shows Perez moved as Massa started to pass.

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      1. aveli says:

        if massa wanted to pass perez into that corner massa should have been alongside perez long before they made contact. it was crazy of massa to have attempted to pass perez so late into the corner. I cannot believe massa attempted that pass after driving in f1 for so many years. he should’ve started his move at the start of the straight so that by the end of the straight he would’ve been been alongside to out rake perez into the corner. massa was at fault and should be given 5 penalty points on his license. the stewards are from the yts.

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    7. Karl says:

      You’re clearly ignoring the fact that the track itself turns slightly to the right before turning left into turn 1. If you keep your steering straight, you’re effectively moving left relative to the confines of the track (so all of these bs arguments and even the comment by perez himself saying he was keeping it straight is total crap and just an excuse – look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23uOt_sF7sY, Vettel keeps it slightly to the right until the very last moment before turn 1). By moving right Massa was in fact staying straight with the track and that’s why it’s considered that Perez ran into him.

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  2. Terry says:

    Some truth in what Massa is bemoaning.
    However,I recall Lewis Hamilton having the same issues with Felipe 3 or 4 seasons back.
    Unfortunately,the FIA’s reoccurring theme of inconsistent rulings will see this type of behaviour around forever.
    Speaking of FIA officiating,how did ROS not incur a penalty for jumping that chicane ?
    He escaped the DRS 1 sec zone for goodness sake,a definite advantage gained in my honest opinion.
    Its killing the sport.

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    1. Random 79 says:

      I wouldn’t say that inconsistent rulings are killing the sport, but I would suggest that having a dedicated team of the same stewards at each GP rather than having a different guest steward for each one might go some way toward some consistency, but I think it is a bit better now that they call on people with actual racing experience.

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    2. Rodrigo says:

      What those incidentes have to do with this ? Lewis caused most of those incidents
      And take a look here http://s2.glbimg.com/hNs4viGu3jX6fzl-kGwGaKhgKYs=/300×397/s.glbimg.com/es/ge/f/original/2014/06/09/massa_perez1_blog.jpg

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      1. D1M0NST3R says:

        Excuse me, but… when you hit a car from the left back, the front goes to the left… that picture is when they touched, not before.

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      2. Torchwood Five says:

        “Lewis caused most of those incidents”

        And by definition, Lewis did not cause ALL those incidents, yet Massa would still collide with Lewis as he attempted to pass, knowing that the Stewards would be penalising Lewis, which, in that year, you could see their point as he had built up enough of a bad rep in the first half of that year, like Maldanado and Grosjean in 2012/13.

        It took, I think, Alan Jones as a guest steward, to notice what was going on in the latter half of the season, and finally penalise Massa.

        There was even a broadcast message from Rob Smedley, telling Massa to “ruin Hamilton’s race” as he tried a pass.

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  3. Simmo says:

    I think there is fault here on both sides, and I am disappointed with the decision of penalty. It was a racing incident where both drivers are guilty. Perez did move left, but equally Massa did slam into the back of him.

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    1. aveli says:

      both massa and perez were closing up on vettel and perez had to turn to pass vettel but just before he turned massa ran into him. i thin massa is to Blair because at the point of contact massa was moving towards perez and perez was going straight. massa could see perez right in front of him so he should’ve moved further to the left if he was to make that move stick. massa’s front right connected with perez’s left rear. if massa was alongside, it would’ve been a different story.
      hamilton didn’t collide with rosberg at turn 2 when rosberg turned into hamilton

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      1. Dansus says:

        No.

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      2. aveli says:

        yes. have a look at all the overtaking moves and you’ll notice that they all start at the start or middle of the straight and by the end of the straight, the cars are side by side for braking into the corner. massa wanted to start his move into the corner when he should’ve been braking. the stewards are as crazy as massa.

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    2. hansb says:

      100% agree. There was so much space at the left of Perez, yet Massa took a racing line as close as possible next to Perez. At 300 km/h Massa himself should have gives more space and Perez can be blamed for moving left although it was marginal.

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      1. Rodrigo says:

        The way you sad it seems to be very easy. In the middle of that right “corner” Perez suddenly stopped turning right. And in the video you see him looking in the mirror and he knew that massa was REALLY close. I don’t think Perez would want to cause something like that but he changed direction and 300km/h is not that easy to have a reaction fast enough.

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  4. Benjamin Dyer says:

    On first look I was convinced Felipe was at fault, but there is a great video circulating of the event that shows Perez moving off the racing line far too late, Felipe was committed.

    However I think this misses the bigger point, what was Felipe doing there in the beginning. He’s clearly fast, the machinery is great and at that stint of the race he was on relatively fresh rubber. The thing that seems to have abandoned him is his race craft. This race was a classic example for him, he had opportunity to clear one if not both of the bulls in the previous laps but somehow couldn’t put it together. Its been the same story for a long time now, apart from a mini revival over three races last season its been the same story.

    Fast, nice guy, but I think he’s time was up last season. Time for another Feilpe to have an opportunity, Mr Nasr.

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    1. D1M0NST3R says:

      I dont know if I can post a link to graphic where you can see how Perez was going wide from the start… http://imgur.com/WRTu05L

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      1. Richard says:

        Amazing – can everyone please just look at this??

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      2. Spectreman says:

        I did, and it settles it for me: Perez was totally to blame, Massa did nothing wrong.

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      3. Ben says:

        I have now looked at this graphic and does show that Perez moved across but I thought that the rules state that the lead driver is allowed to do one movement to defend his position?? I still feel that Massa should have given him more space but either way it is very marginal and I think Massa’s comments were a bit harsh

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      4. aveli says:

        I have seen this and it tells me that massa tried to start a move too late into the corner. all the overtaking moves start either at the start or middle of the straight ending up with the cars side by side for braking. massa tried a crazy overtaking move and destroyed perez’s chance of finishing fourth.iI noticed this images has fooled some people already.

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      5. Richard D says:

        Until I saw this graphic I thought Massa had tried a dangerous last-ditch lunge but this proves me wrong.

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    2. Dansus says:

      Agreed.

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  5. GAZ BOY says:

    I’ll go along with that Felipe.
    I think there are two issues. Firstly, spatial awareness from Mr Perez seems to be rather lacking. Is this a driver issue or an issue with the driving position of these new generation of cars? Perhaps it’s just Checo being somewhat obstinate, which is understandable on the last lap to some extent, but also rather dangerous..
    Secondly, the other issue is that of the DRS and it’s massive over-speed. Actually, the DRS on its own isn’t an issue, but it is when drivers start to gently weave or arc. Perhaps I’ve answered my own query: maybe it was Checo gently arcing and his lack of spatial awareness that was ultimately to blame, not the DRS in itself (although in all fairness, both Ben Edwards and DC in the BBC commentary commented on the dangerous overspeed and clipping issues.)
    Well anyway, Checo has a punishment: let’s hope he learns from it, a la Grosjean 2012, if not the GPDA needs to seriously consider having a “nice chat” about him.

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    1. Sami says:

      The point of spatial awareness reminds me of the issue between Checo and Kimi at Monaco last year.
      I do consider that Perez was to blame in both cases. He is extremely courageous, but should be more aware when racing in a pack.
      I do remember that Mario Andretti once pointed out that Indy Racing taught him how to race very close to his rivals and when to trust them.
      Yesterday Juan Pablo Montoya made comments on an American TV stressing that it was Checo’s fault.
      Words of someone who knows one or two things about F1 racing…

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      1. cee says:

        I fail to see how this incident in regards to spacial awareness is just on Perez.
        Last year monaco was definitely on his head but this incident is absolutely different to that. He was leading on the inside line where as Massa was caught out trying to go around the outside. It was a silly move from Massa as there was no way he would’ve stopped it in time considering Vettel would’ve been in the vicinity. Racing incident imo

        Also just because JPM said it was checos fault doesn’t mean he’s correct regardless of f1 experience. I mean there was no spacial awareness between him and the infamous cameraman was there. Just thought id throw it in there for a laugh.

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    2. aveli says:

      looking at all the evidence, massa has exceeded his sell by date. ricciardo passed perez, no collision. vettel passed perez, no collision. massa just rammed into the back of perez instead of passing like ricciardo and vettel did and start calling for unnecessary punishment for the innocent victim. massa and smedly are cut from the same cloth and shouldn’t be allowed to muddy the water.
      either the stewards are blind or are not qualified to do the job. ex drivers or not. they should have the ability to look at evidence, understand it and make a correct judgement based on the evidence they analyse. this idea of hiding behind so called data is insulting to us fans. publish that data then if it holds so much value. let us see those magical data which result in such biased decisions.

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  6. Pauld says:

    I might be in the minority, and also it goes against the steward’s findings, but I think Massa put his car in a crazy place. The only way I can accept it’d be Perez’s fault is if he braked much earlier than before and this would have caught Massa out.

    Massa came from miles back, and Perez only moved a very small amount and he was well into the braking zone by then trying to start the corner turn in. Massa hit his back wheel, so I can’t see how he can claim he was alongside.

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  7. Sebee says:

    This may sound wrong but, you run onto someone from the back, it’s your fault in my book.

    Perez had a brake issue right? Did he have a direct comm link to Massa? What was he to do if he couldn’t go hard into that section? I’m not even sure the 5 places penalty is entirely deserved.

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    1. gaz Boy says:

      Aw, come on Sebee, Checo caused an avoidable accident. And at accident where Massa had an impact of 27G……………
      If you watch in slow motion, Checo “pinched” Felipe. I’m afraid Mr Perez does have spatial awareness issues. Remember last year when he head-butted himself and Kimi into the barrier at Monaco and the Choc Ice specialist threatened to punch his lights out or words to that affect?
      Felipe is very, very fortunate he hasn’t ended up with concussion. Thank goodness for the sectional solidity of the carbon fibre monocoque: also the HANS device saved Massa from a cricked neck.

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      1. aveli says:

        if perez has any issues why and how did the two red bulls pass him without a collision? massa is the problem, he hasn’t completely recovered from the injuries he sustained form being hit by barrichello’s spring. he shouldn’t be racing anything.

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      2. Sebee says:

        OK, I laughed at this one a bit. Does it make me evil?

        Perez did have Vettel ahead, maybe he wanted to get some clear air for his brakes? And anyway, isn’t he allowed one move?

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      3. aveli says:

        @sebee, if perez wanted to cool his brakes why did he not pull out of vettel’s wake earlier on th

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      4. sixwheeler says:

        Everyone defending Felipe has no idea about racing, or has not seen the video from above, where it is clear that Massa decided to go for the inside of the upcoming left turn but immediately realized he needed a better line and before passing (or even getting alongside Perez), HE MOVED TO THE RIGHT, a fraction of a second before the Force India started moving toward his defending racing line. Without that slight move to the right of the Williams they would have been side by side before the turn. Perez did absolutely nothing wrong, all you tv racing experts, mostly the ones talking about Perez looking in his mirror, as if approching a stop sign at any neighborhood speed, but especially gaz Boy. How can you “pinch” a car that is behind you???? Your idea of racing is having lanes, like in swimming pools!

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      5. collin doyle says:

        sounds good, except you are not allowed to move to defend your line in the braking zone, or under braking, which is what perez did. Making a dive inside at turn 1 in Canada is not all that rare, but becomes nearly impossible and incredibly dangerous if the driver your overtaking changes his line in the braking zone. This is why the steward correctly penalized Perez. If he wanted to defend, he needed to do so prior to the right hand sweep that proceeds the corner. If his brakes are overheating and he’s having difficulty with the car, then his bailout position is to the right, not left where he risks a collision.

        20.4
        Any driver defending his position on a straight, and before any braking area, may use the full width of the track during his first move, provided no significant portion of the car attempting to pass is alongside his. Whilst defending in this way the driver may not leave the track without justifiable reason.
        For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a ‘significant portion’.

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    2. Elie says:

      Your not wrong at all on this one Sebee. I was looking for any reason possible to throw it all on Perez, But aside of slightly covering the inside . Felipe drove straight into the back of him with at least full car width on the inside!..He had several options to avoid an accident & IMHO even a solid chance to pass on the inside or do the switch back on corner exit.

      This incident whilst very dramatic was less stupid than either China & Monaco 2013 with Raikkonen only for some reason looks like the stewards saved it for now!. Absolutely ridiculous. I dont know what pull Massa has in F1 but 2011 Monaco with Hamilton went all his way for absolutely no reason. Felipe is easily becoming the worst driver in F1 & in such a great Williams package – I really feel for them. Thanks to years of 2nd fiddle at Ferrari he has forgotten how to win.

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      1. CUges77 says:

        Yep, that’s right, so where was Bottas in the race. The data and the image analysis clearly states that it is Perez fault. Yes Felipe is make it tight but moving over in the braking zone is not on. The last lap and another position was their and he went for it. He seems to do this a lot Perez who expects everyone to move out of his way when he overtakes yet doesn’t play by the same rules. You can not have it both ways.

        Still Felipe should of won this race, but then again Williams strategy seemed all over the place and also his first pit-stop (7 seconds) put him back. Felipe still has more to give

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    3. Rishi says:

      Also felt it was Massa’s fault. He would have surely been told over the radio that Perez had a problem and surely he should have left a bit more room for error in the pass. Instead, he ended up putting both drivers in danger. And this for a man with 10+ years experience. I agree with Hudson from an earlier comment thread; I have historically been a big Massa fan but, while I’m very encouraged by his speed versus Bottas, and while he has had bad luck, he also has too many erratic moments given his level of experience. I felt really sorry for Williams because they were on for some really good points too.

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    4. Daniel says:

      I think this is an interesting point. If a driver has less than ideal brakes and wants to take a straighter approach to a corner apex – to help balance the car. Can the driver behind complain that it makes passing harder? Also as they were going around a gradual right curve, could Perez claim he was using his one “move”?

      I tend to be a Massa fan, but I can’t help but feel he’s complaining because Perez didn’t take the corner the way he wanted him to.

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  8. victor says:

    Hi
    James:Im long time follower of your site, i like the new look. Quick question what happened to the F1 TWEETER FEEDS. Are they coming back?

    Thanks

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  9. rad_g says:

    I’m not surprised he’s disappointed. Those were some good points but also a very dangerous situation. If Vettel was 5 / 6 metres up the road he would get a direct impact by the Williams nose. It could have been a completely different ending.

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  10. fox says:

    Massa is a loser #1 from the current and previous pilot generation. I couldn’t imagine how Williams calculated whether to take him on board.

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  11. Tara says:

    No mention of penalty points? I thought that this kind of incident was the reason they were brought in, in the first place.
    As Massa said its not the first time drivers have expressed concerns over Perez, I don’t think 5 places is enough either.

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    1. jk says:

      There might be an element of truth in what Massa says about Perez..
      But with regard to this incident, it was a racing incident between 2 drivers who are prone to ding-dongs. I cannot put it any nicer than that.

      Here is another way to look at it.. a faster driver than massa with the car he had would not have been in that track position in the first place, meaning the accident would not have happened, because he should/would have been behind Vettel or better.

      Any other sensible driver in that situation would not have tried a maneuver in that manner. It was not clean enough. Massa took a risk in a move that is reliant on 3rd party cooperation. And 3rd party being Perez…Massa has no rights to complain what so ever.

      They were guilty as each other.

      And maybe massa should say sorry to Daniel for his maiden chequered flag being under a SC…

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      1. aveli says:

        massa should say sorry to perez for smashing into the back of him, wrecking his race.

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  12. mIKE84 says:

    Firstly, it’s nice when someone tries to improve a site but if there were a poll I’d vote for the way it was before; for one thing, the font is too hard to read (no need to copy Apple when they’re wrong!), it’s too white like a big flashlight in the face (again, an Apple flaw), and the layout is no better IMO. Sorry but this is the last time I’ll be posting if the text remains this hard to read.

    Back to racing, it’s understandable after having a second trauma to a formerly broken skull & previously concussed brain that Massa would come out of the car talking like that (video looked like his head almost ripped off in the collision), but IMO he’d be better off talking less and just focusing on the job. Perez moved, but Massa knew it was Perez, right? Leave some space and preserve your points.

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    1. Super Seven says:

      I have to agree.
      Don’t like the new layout. Looks horrible on my Android tablet.
      Prefer the old one.

      Perez moved, but the amount was very small. Massa could have left quite a bit more room on the pass. Scary crash, and Vettel did well to avoid being speared off with them.

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    2. Elam says:

      I too agree. The site layout and font make it difficult/tiring to read. Though I vastly enjoy the site, am afraid it may soon become too much of an effort to read.

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    3. bogdan says:

      I agree with you about the font on the website. Don’t like it one bit. Hope they will change it.

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  13. aveli says:

    i don’t understand how the stewards came to the decision that perez was at fault in th crassh. I have watched it over and over again and can see that massa was behind and could see exactly where perez was. perez didn’t move across for a whole secon before they made contact. that part of the track was not a safe place to overtake but massa was too eager and met his fate.

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  14. Bryan says:

    The problem with Felipe’s analysis, as illustrated by overhead and onboard video[1] is that after Perez began to veer left, Felipe made a much more aggressive turn right, directly into Perez, while Perez’s car was clearly in view.

    Whether it’s due to tired reflexes, bad situational awareness, or bad attitude, one expects a professional F1 driver not to make mistakes like these. Even assuming Perez was wrong to crowd him into the apex, this was an avoidable accident.

    In my view, Felipe is often a bit too quick to criticise others and demand they be punished (contrast his and Kobayashi’s behaviour after Australia). Yet the reality is he crashes more than other racers, as Lewis’s last year with Maclaren illustrated.

    I think he needs to take a good look at himself. A better driver could have avoided that crash and earned a lot of points and prestige for Williams. Instead he got himself in a bizarre accident, trashed the car, then petulantly demanded that the grownups punish nasty little Sergio Perez

    [1] http://balls.ie/news/f1-drivers-hospitalised-huge-crash-canadian-grand-prix/

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    1. Seán Craddock says:

      Felipe turned to the right because that’s the way the track goes!

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      1. JSpeed says:

        Finally someone saw that track, in that sector, has a slight right hand curve before turn 1

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      2. aveli says:

        he can’t just turn to the right while another car is there. i think massa shouldn’t be in f1 if he just wants to follow the racing line at all cost. not a single pass was made at that corner all race 70 laps by nearly 19 cars. only massa could make such a move and blame someone else, demanding wicked punishment for them. i wonder what drugs the stewards take while making their decisions.

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      1. aveli says:

        this is wrong. watch the video footage which shows the truth. perez drove into the corner directly behind vettel. why vettel want to drive off the natural racing line?
        someone is trying to fool others while the video evidence is still available.

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    2. Bryan says:

      So Rodrigo, Seán and JSpeed all have missed the point.

      I know the track turns right. That’s why I said “Perez veered left … to crowd him into the apex”

      My point is that Felipe put himself in a position where he would be very sensitive to such a move, and then failed to react fast enough to avoid a collision. In fact, he began turning right _after_ Perez began moving left.

      His reflexes just weren’t quick enough.

      Also, with the speed differential he had, he didn’t need to be so close to Perez, or to try to crowd him _away_ from the apex. He could have kept a car width apart and forced Perez wide after the apex, just as Rosberg did to Hamilton.

      Felipe also struggled to pass Vettel, apparently forgetting to open his DRS at one point.

      So his race-craft seems, as Martin Brundle charitably put it, “a little rusty”

      Total votes:
      0

    3. Ben says:

      That video very much makes it look like Massa’s fault but this graphic tells a different story: http://imgur.com/WRTu05L
      Either way it was very marginal and I think both drivers should take some blame. Massa’s comments were very harsh.

      Total votes:
      0

  15. Sebee says:

    Is it me, or is this new website layout a bit like the RB10?

    Slow out of the gate, and will take a few GPs to become a winner? :-)

    Total votes:
    0

    1. Sebee says:

      I have a feeling this new layout is going to hit JAonF1 views. It’s been a few days and I have to admit, I enjoy it less and less. It’s not clean across browsers, it’s slower and may be hitting the server harder with the “fancy” graphic elements (which I’m not sure add to enjoyment), and there is no mobile build. I do feel a little bad complaining, as a free guest and all, but isn’t it for ultimately for us?

      Does JAonF1 keep this new complicated V6 ERA PU layout, or does it go back to the good old V8 era layout? :-)

      I wonder what the feedback would be if the site went back to old graphic rules and layout. Would there be a cheer of joy?

      Total votes:
      0

      1. Colm says:

        I’m sorry to support this view also as there was obviously a considerable cost involved in building the new layout…it is quite “clunky” in comparison to the old site. A bit heavier, requires more thought to steer through. Actually, come to think of it, it’s totally appropriate for this season.

        Total votes:
        0

      2. CHEESYPOOF says:

        I have to generally agree… It’s harder to see users names in comments and text in general. I usually get on here several times a day but sad to say over the last two days I’ve thought about it and decided otherwise because it’s harder to read than most sites. No harm in trying new things but… The future is Mobile computing and the site isn’t too friendly on that front it seems currently. A good attempt though.

        Total votes:
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  16. Frans says:

    The problem is that Perez already moved to the left before even Massa front wing was next to Perez rear wheel, so from my point of view what Perez do was fair. What is strange is that Massa was moving to the right. Sure, the racing line is in the right, but the fact is that another car already there. Even if Perez wasn’t moving to the left, Massa would still be very close to Perez and might touch.

    Total votes:
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  17. JB says:

    Hmm… Massa kamikazed into Perez and wants Perez to gain more penalty.
    I honestly wondered why Perez got a penalty in the first place. Seems like Stewards don’t like him.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. aveli says:

      the stewards penalised perez because force india didn’t make a representation while smedly presented several videos and data asking the stewards to punish perez. massa should receive 5 penalty points for trying that move in that corner in the first place.

      Total votes:
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      1. kenneth chapman says:

        @ aveli….where did you get the information re FI not making any representations to the stewards?

        Total votes:
        0

      2. aveli says:

        this is wrong. watch the video footage which shows the truth. perez drove into the corner directly behind vettel. why vettel want to drive off the natural racing line?

        Total votes:
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      3. aveli says:

        this message about posting too fast is frustrating. now i post in the wrong place.
        @kenneth chapman, do you have evidence to the contrary?

        Total votes:
        0

    2. Robert says:

      Massa kamikazed into Perez and wants Perez to gain more penalty.
      I honestly wondered why Perez got a penalty in the first place. Seems like Stewards don’t like him.

      i tottaly agree with this comment! Shame on Massa

      Total votes:
      0

  18. Chris says:

    Is it only me that thought it was an unfortunate race incident? Perez didn’t make a violate shift in his direction, and I thought you were entilted to change your line once?

    Total votes:
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    1. Seán Craddock says:

      Not in the braking zone though. You’re right that you can change your line but the rules state this must be before the braking zone. Perez changed his line when he hit the brakes

      Total votes:
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      1. BW says:

        The “before braking area” issue is referred to in a rule allowing the defending driver to use the full width of the track on straight and not in a rule allowing for one change of direction.

        Total votes:
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      2. aveli says:

        perez didn’t change his line. he didn’t move for a whole second before massa rammed into the back of him. just because brundle said he did doesn’t mean he did. have a look at the video footages. we all can see.

        Total votes:
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      3. Spinodontosaurus says:

        That is precisely the problem! Perez was driving straight on a part of the track that blatantly turns to the right. So Perez essentially moved across the track into the path of Massa and then braked. Stewards called this right.

        Total votes:
        0

      4. Elie says:

        This is not true on 2 counts
        1. Your allowed to move over anywhere as long as you leave a cars width-Otherwise how do you think so many passes are effected on approach, through& after the apex????

        2. Perez drifted left and stayed straight before the braking zone !the impact happened a few seconds later.

        Total votes:
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    2. Steve Zodiac says:

      No it’s not just you, I have watched and re-watch the available video and it looks like Felipe was just a bit unlucky ( or lucky actually). It’s no good critisising Perez he has done an excellent job this year. It is likewise no good critisising Massa, if you don’t go for the gap you are no longer a racong driver.

      Total votes:
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      1. aveli says:

        massa went for the car not the gap and he is no longer a racing driver.

        Total votes:
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  19. Joe Barreto says:

    The problem with Perez is that Mexican press continues to place Sergio as a hero. Media is saying that it was the best race of his life! How can it be a great race if he continues to do the same, drive slow, manage the tires and not completing the race. Fortunatly the accident was not worse, Perez and Maldonado need to be taken out of the field to keep other drivers safe.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. ferggsa says:

      Sorry to disagree, PER does not drive slow, the FI does not have the speed of the MBs or RBs, and still managed to close on one and keep the others at bay for a long time, also passed his much acclaimed team mate in the process

      As for strategy, the team makes those decisions rather than himself, so he is told what his employer tells him to do, with a pretty good performance

      Regarding finishing races, I unhappily have to agree with you

      Total votes:
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  20. Franed says:

    Somewhat unfair on Perez! What on earth was Massa trying to do? Ovetake just there? Had he got further he would have missed the apex anyway.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. jay west says:

      Dead on right! Massa was flying into that corner with both Perez and Vettel braking. He was going too fast to have made the apex and, by looking at the overhead, clearly turned in right AFTER Perez had nudged left. Just seems that Felipe wants to avoid taking any blame here. I can’t see how the stewards put this entirely on Perez. And given the available footage, it makes Massa look foolish to put it all on Perez. He should not have attempted that pass given the proximity of the corner. Had he managed to get around Perez safely, he would have had to brake hard and Perez would have likely gone through ahead of him by the corner exit.

      Total votes:
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  21. Harsha says:

    James, SFI just posted a picture from Felipe’s onboard showing his steering weel turned a bit to the right, and that of Sergio maintaining his line. Your thoughts?

    Total votes:
    0

    1. James Allen says:

      Also some quotes from Perez saying he didn’t deviate. Looked like he did on TV and he got -5 places from the stewards so they clearly thought so

      Total votes:
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      1. Sebee says:

        Those stewards always get it right, as Lewis fans know.

        I like Massa, but I think it’s more on him than on Perez in this case. Look at the overhead view replays a few times.

        Perez has to suck it up, right? No way to appeal that 5 place?

        Total votes:
        0

      2. BW says:

        Formally, an appeal is allowed according to Articles 16 and 17 of the Sporting Regulations.

        Curious if wordpress would tell me again that I’m should slow down…

        Total votes:
        0

      3. Sebee says:

        Since we can’t limit ourselves BW, the admins limited us. How much of our drivel do you think they want to proof read each day?

        Total votes:
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      4. gaz Boy says:

        He did, he “pinched” Massa, so Felipe has every right to feel annoyed (I would imagine Massa had a bad head-ache to insult to injury so to speak!).
        I actually think the stewards are being a bit lenient, I guess they are giving Checo the benefit of the doubt, do that again son and your’re going to be banned for a race…..

        Total votes:
        0

      5. jk says:

        @James,
        I believe what Perez is saying to be true in nature, but not factually. Even though his car did actually deviate to the left, as can be seen by helicopter view, I see no steering wheel input of such nature from Perez onboard to suggest that it was an intentional move.
        And the rate at which he was moving to the left is far less and passive compare to Massas moving to the right. Even though I believe that it was an innocent racing incident between 2 drivers, neither with 100% blame (even though it doesn’t surprise me that those 2, as well as Maldonado, Grosjean and Ericsson are very clumsy risk takers lacking somewhat in racecraft and are prone to being involved in incidents), many are left wondering about the rationality of the decision made by the stewards.

        The bigger picture.. who were the 3 stewards who felt the penalty was justified? I am entitled to opinions, as are anyone, including those stewards. Frankly speaking because I am fed up with their inconsistency to be kind, and disagree with their incompetence to be honest, I feel not only this incident, but their recent track records in the last few years leave a lot begging.

        I can predict your response, arguing that the stewards have all the data and technology at their disposal.

        Well, that’s not good enough if you ask me. I am not a 7 year old who is told so, and questioning why, being told “just because I am your parent” doesn’t cut it.

        Just to go on record, I am neither a Perez or a Massa fan. I love F1 as a race and a sport, have done so for 20 years now. I am slightly different to those who are fans of a particular driver or team.

        And it is irritating, where tennis has Hawkeye, football is progressing with goal line camera, rugby has instant replay for the ref not to jump to conclusions….

        Stewards can make the verdict, but show the reasoning with comments supported with evidence which only they the stewards have access to. Release the privileged data so all can agree. Until that happens, I cannot possibly understand why Perez was 100% to blame.
        “IF” Perez was more guilty and responsible, then surely Massa played a role in it. IF accomplice to a crime is punishable in real life, what happens here?
        These kind of debacles need to be called out by the sponsors, just like FIFA.
        Fans need to be able to understand, accept, and be satisfied with decisions that alter results of a race.

        Total votes:
        0

      6. aveli says:

        those stewards must have some chemical assistance to make such crazy decisions.

        Total votes:
        0

  22. Guillermo says:

    I think this was probably 60/40 Checo’s fault. He did swerve late, but Felipe placed his car so that any move by Perez to his left would result in contact.

    It reminds me of the number 1 rule of defensive driving: anticipate dangerous moves from the driver in front.

    In many ways, those two are quite similar. They always put themselves in dangerous places on the track.

    Total votes:
    0

  23. D1M0NST3R says:

    Honestly, Perez didnt moved his wheel to crash into Massa, Massa did a zig zag out/in too quick, he changed his car direction twice, Perez just went wide but did it in one move…

    Total votes:
    0

  24. Delgado says:

    This isn’t the first time that senor Perez has shown a wreckless side to his driving. It’s also quite astonishing how the ‘bad luck’ follows Massa…

    Total votes:
    0

  25. Carlos Marques says:

    Massa slammed into the back of Perez, who had to break slightly early than the usual to make sure he would not hit Vettel…

    I did see Perez move slightly to his left in one of the replays, but it looks like a side-effect of his breaking efforts rather than positive/meaningful/forceful/intentional steering input to crash/block Massa.

    But the FIA has all the data at their disposal and they never make mistakes. What can all the F1 drivers take away from all this? Don’t race- just follow closely until you can undercut your opponent in the pits. Yay…

    Total votes:
    0

  26. Onyx says:

    I just wish Massa would get out of F1…always whinging and quite honestly wasting a good car..Williams used to be racers..just moaners now.No wonder they’ve never wanted 3 car teams,it will just show them up!

    Total votes:
    0

  27. Colm says:

    Totally gutted for Williams and Massa…

    Total votes:
    0

  28. Mhilgtx says:

    Pretty simple Masa hit Perez from the rear. 100% Masa in the wrong. Although I think it was a racing incident and nothing more.

    Total votes:
    0

  29. saffa says:

    Massa’s inconsistency of shining on his day continues. This was meant to be a great result for Williams. Massa shouldve seen for lap after lap that Perez had issues or wouldve informed by da team. Perez was in da breaking zone when his car twitched to da left. Could it have been the bad condition of da car that caused that twitch under braking. Anyway u look at it Massa was not along side him and shouldve realised da danger of an early braking car in front of him.

    I.m sorry but for me this was da usual Massa. How many hesitant looks he had in those last twenty laps with his fresher tires. This was another on the wrong car (perez). As a racer he shouldve recognised an early braking car.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. jk says:

      I am so sad for Williams, annoyed with massa making a comment like “we lost some good points today” and “if the team didn’t botch the first pit stop I could have won”…

      “You” lost good points today, not the team. It was not 100% Perez causing the accident..You could have avoided it.

      And pretty much all other worthy drivers would have capitalised with a win or decent amount of points, regardless of the pit stop.

      Total votes:
      0

  30. Dan says:

    Massa should have walked away with this race the pace he had. We shouldnt be talking about incidents his race craft is really poor, shame really i was screaming at the tv at a possible williams win/podium.

    Total votes:
    0

  31. patrick says:

    The penalty It’s a bit srange for Perez!

    Yes it was dangerous! but they were driving at more than 150mph, that’s already dangerous
    who had the more clear view of the situation ?
    Massa or Perez?

    Massa had room at his left, and he could see exactly where is perez.

    How in today f1 car could Perez see the exact position of massa’s front car, at the same time he had to manage his ERS/brakes at the same time go throught turn 1 and 2…
    All this after 69laps, at the last lap of a race

    How can a driver defend his position in today formula one?

    Massa was suposed to make a safe and clear pass (That his job)
    If he want the driver in front of him to open the door for him, just put a horn on the car (joke)

    How can we define clearly a racing incident?

    People are talking only about massa’s crash (with 27G) but Perez also crashed (32G) (check the video from each car waoow)

    The important part of all this, is they are both OK!

    Total votes:
    0

  32. ferggsa says:

    Seems opinions are quite divided, I do think PER moved slowly left to defend his position, and braked sooner than usual, probably because of his faulty brakes, surprising MAS, and thus earning the stewards penalty
    In hindsight, he probably should have let MAS go and keep 10 points, but then we would be crying he does not have the winning spirit

    RIC passed in the same spot but on the right side, to avoid PER closing the line, and VET just waited for the DRS zone and a safe pass

    MAS was desperate (as was PER after losing two spots) and dived too close at a narrowing gap and was caught by the sudden slowdown
    I wonder if PER had kept right, MAS might have just slammed into VET or just overshoot the corner altogether

    Total votes:
    0

    1. aveli says:

      ilooked at the video footages and noticed that both massa and perez were closing on vettel so perez couldn’t have braked earlier. vettel was on his brakes before massa smashed into perez. if perez wasn’t there, massa would’ve smashed into vettel because there was no way he could have slowed the car down enough to make that corner. he accelerated instead of braking into the corner.

      Total votes:
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  33. Caterhamfan says:

    Another vote for a return to the “old” website – took me ages to find my way around :(

    Total votes:
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    1. Doug says:

      Yes, the new layout is not easy on the eyes, and more difficult to navigate. Change is good, if it’s good change.

      Total votes:
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  34. Allan says:

    I too believe that the problem was caused by Massa being way too optimistic about going down the inside at that point.

    I do feel the Penalty was deserved at all.

    I also think that the Race should have been Red Flagged, which would have given Massa and Perez their positions on the previous lap.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. Allan says:

      I do NOT feel the Penalty was deserved… typo

      Total votes:
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  35. jmv says:

    An experienced racer like Massa should have been wiser not to attempt an overtake at that turn.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. cLARKS4wHEELdRiFT says:

      Don’t get that, a pass down the inside into turn 1 under braking would be fine here. Not all overtakes need a Tilke special 30mph hairpin. Others did it, heck Dan even did it round the outside, just! It’s not like say trying a pass at the bottom of Eau Rouge…

      Total votes:
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  36. Brett says:

    I saw the accident happen in front of me on sunday and you could see Perez braked very early, look at the gap to Vettel, it suddenly expands enormously as he brakes much earlier.

    Agreed that defensive driving is important for us as the normal road is full of idiots, the Joy of F1 is that there are not supposed to be idiots on the track and they can push to limit and rely on the other person being reliable.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. jk says:

      Interested to hear what your opinion is, since you saw it live in front of you.

      Judging by the number of posts, majority seen to think blame is more on massa than Perez, contrary to marshals findings.

      I can give benefit of the doubt to both drivers, and call it a racing incident. Neither is clearly fully responsible for the crash. It takes 2 to tango, and it doesn’t surprise me one bit that if it had to be a combo of drivers eligible for avoidable accidents as such, it is sure bet that massa, Perez, Maldonado and any rookie were involved.

      I am bored, spent last 30 minutes watching YouTube footage of the crash…

      Checking the heli view, as well as both car’s onboards, it is indeed baffling. I cannot see Perez make a steering input to the left, even though his car slowly drifts to the left.
      As for Massa, what was he doing? Was it a maneuver to overtake or not? Some say Perez was breaking earlier, and I am unsure about that (hence your opinion is appreciated! ) but, assuming he braked earlier than usual, that would imply that massa was moving right to slot in behind Perez for the corner, giving up on the overtake.

      Total votes:
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  37. mikeboy0001 says:

    What a heck is going on with the stewarts?
    This was clearly Massa fault, who must be Maldonado’s brother
    Ruined the Force India’s race and wants to come out as the vctim!
    What a soap opera

    Total votes:
    0

  38. Steve S says:

    That was a racing incident in my book, both drivers were partly at fault. Perez moved left at the last moment, but Massa was flying into the corner far too fast. If not for the contact with Perez he’d have either hit Vettel or gone off track.

    Very fortunate for Rosberg as the accident and yellow flag saved second place for him, otherwise VET would have had him by the finish.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. aveli says:

      of course it was a racing incident. they were in a race and the incident occurred so it’s a racing incident but caused by massa losing control of his car.

      Total votes:
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  39. michael grig says:

    i think that Massa was never able to take the chicane at that speed+position

    Total votes:
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  40. delidimos says:

    from this you can see that is 100% perez fault.thas why he did get 5 places.

    Total votes:
    0

  41. Elam says:

    Massa should take an honest serious look at himself as a driver. Given the problems with the Mercs, he was in the best position to win the race. He was unable to make the best of the opportunity for a long time, and got desperate at the end – not the mark of a champion, and am afraid his time has past.

    Total votes:
    0

  42. ANIL OJESWI says:

    Hi James,

    Don’t you think it is unfair not to publish Perez’s side of the story? Without that this article could be misleading. It gives an impression that Perez is at fault. He could be, but from what I saw, Massa was way too ambitious with that move. Everybody knew Perez was struggling with brakes, was nursing his tyres and was on the LAST LAP! Would you do that turn 1 at 300 kmph? Would you do that when there are two cars ahead of you? Would you do that knowing the car in front has so many problems?

    Perez was out of line, may be he was letting Massa pass him. May be he was being cautious and staying away or just could not keep the line because he didnt have brakes. How fair is it to give him a 5 place grid penalty? He lost so many points for himself and the team, that is punishment in itself. How many times have incidents like these been passed as just racing incidents?

    Total votes:
    0

    1. James Allen says:

      Note: This comment was left before Perez side of the story was issued and added to the post – Mod

      Total votes:
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  43. Lohani says:

    Massa made 2 bad decisions, which had nothing to do with causing that accident.

    1. He trusted Perez. Period.
    2. Massa was trying to stay as wide as possible to take the ideal line on T1. He should have stayed much to the left, took T1 and then driven straight for the apex on T2. This would have naturally given him the speed to stay ahead. But, you never know with Perez. He could have turned on Massa in that situation too.

    Massa was turning left out of Perez’s slipstream to pass him on T1. Right at that moment, Perez moved left. When a car is gaining on you alongside, you simply hold your line, which Perez didn’t do. Hence, the penalty. The rules are clear.

    I remember Webber overtaking Alonso at Eu Rouge in Spa in a very tight situation without crashing. That overtake was potentially more dangerous than this one. Both drivers knew where each other was. Alonso saw where Webber was. Webber knew he could trust Alonso. Both drivers got through Eu Rouge without crashing, because Alonso gave Webber room. The overtake looked awesome. That’s what F1 is – driving on the limit with awesome moves.

    Perez has shown time an time again that he cannot be trusted. All drivers pay heed. Good job by the stewards.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. Lohani says:

      I have to correct myself after looking at the image I posted below. Massa made only one mistake, which was to trust Perez. Perez is 100% to blame here. If he hadn’t crashed with Massa, he could’ve bomb dived on T1 against Vettel. He didn’t have the car under him (with old boots) to try any of those things, which he did and caused a crash. Penalty very justified. In fact, a 10-place grid penalty would have also been justified in my book, because this isn’t the first time Perez has taken unnecessary risks resulting in crashes.

      Total votes:
      0

  44. forzaminardi says:

    One can understand Massa being upset, and Perez’s car did move to the left under braking, but it was hardly a huge swerve or an obviously deliberate attempt to block Massa. Personally to me it looked like Perez’s car simply moved under braking. Massa should have moved further to the left and the fact remains he barrelled into the back of another car – not the first time he’s simply misjudged his braking. I don’t understand why there needs to be blame apportioned in every incident. To me it was simply a racing accident, probably with Massa slightly more at fault, but overall just ‘one of those things’.

    As for Rob Smedley’s words on the matter: we already knew he was a Massa apologist, but in the past he’s spoken only of things he actually knew about. I don’t really understand how he claims to know more about the performance of Perez’s car than Perez himself did.

    Total votes:
    0

  45. Elie says:

    James, I keep getting “your posting too quickly” with almost – day between.

    I just replayed this incident about 12 times from 3 different angles and as much as I dislike Perez it is staggering how much at fault Felipe Massa is.

    Total votes:
    0

    1. James Allen says:

      Issues with a plug in – it’s being dealt with. We had this once before if you remember. We’ll sort it out thanks for your patience everyone.

      Total votes:
      0

    2. kenneth chapman says:

      @ elie…i too share your sentiments. from what i have viewed it is quite simple. they were both wrong but the weight lies with massa.

      just watching it live so many times leaves me with no other impression than it was always going to be a disaster. that is the same impression i got at monaco when raikonnen crashed into magnussen? what is that old saying’ slow in fast out’, in relative terms that is.

      yes, racing drivers make errors like we all do but this was slightly more insofar as the closing speeds do not allow for margins that will temper the outcome. massa was, IMO, most at fault. that would mean then on the basis of probability that they should’ve either have both received a sanction or they both received a penalty. the fact that they both survived bares testament to the superb safety quaities of the modern F1 car.

      Total votes:
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      1. Elie says:

        Thanks but I will correct a very minor detail that both you and Magnussen missed.

        Raikkonen did not “crash into Kevin Magnussen ” he slid wide on the corner in front blocking his path -He did not touch him. It was when he tried to get going again he reversed onto his front wing. Its still wrong I know but he was just trying to get going again and Kmag was still parked there. -Kimi made that abundantly clear but people still say “he collided in him” which is totally incorrect.

        Yet Kimi lost 3rd place when Chilton collided in his tyre at the chicane during the safety car!- not one idiot or steward even raised it- Let alone imposed a penalty

        Total votes:
        0

      2. Elie says:

        http://youtu.be/NqKtdGV003A

        Raikkonen actually got sick of Magnussen just parked there. Wtf was he waiting for. I would hazard a guess if Kimi didnt push him back he probably couldnt continue

        My heart wont bleed for young Kmag after fully colliding with Kimi in 2 races.

        Total votes:
        0

      3. kenneth chapman says:

        @ elie……yes, you are technically correct. so what does that mean. i was simply demonstrating by example that raikonnen, a driver who a lot of people think is a star, also makes impetuous moves that are foolish and will never come to fruition.

        Total votes:
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  46. bronwyn collier says:

    Feel sorry for Perez. I think he’s been hardly done by. Sorry, James, but I don’t like the new website. Not so easy to see everything – messy!

    Total votes:
    0

  47. Lohani says:

    A very good analysis of the incident here: http://oi61.tinypic.com/302xvnr.jpg. Originally posted in a simracing forum: https://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=84841&page=32. This is what the stewards would have also looked at.

    Total votes:
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  48. Omniprescient says:

    I am not priviledged to see telemetry data that the stewards did have, but based on the visual as well as explanatory evidence by FM and SP, I think this was just a racing incident. Massa probably should accept the responsibility (no liability under the rules, though) because he initiated the overtake, and had an obligation to act carefully. Worn brakes of SP car etc should have been on his mind before he had made the move. He had to plan better, that is. Were it eg FA, SP would have been overtaken, taking into account that another top level racer SebVet had just done it prior to it.

    Total votes:
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    1. Lohani says:

      I’m afraid it can’t be said with certainty that Massa miscalculated the overtake. He was already aiming the inside when they all entered that turn with Perez going for the normal racing line on the outside. When Massa was fully committed on that line, Perez’s car moved over where Massa was going. Massa had no time to react at that point. Being ahead, Perez has the right to chose a line going into a turn, yes. If he wanted to defend, he should’ve have made his intentions very clear early on when Massa was behind. Perez’s car veered off-line in the last minute. That is why the penalty is justified.

      As for how fast Massa was going or whether he would make the corner or not cannot be accurately judged by looking at a video clip or the relative speed and braking point of Vettel and Perez, both of whom were on very old tires. Massa wasn’t going too fast there; the other 2 were slower than him. Yes, the overtaking car has the responsibility to make a clean getaway, but you can’t do anything if the car being overlapped comes over to where you are in the last minute.

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  49. mat says:

    my read after also watching this link

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0PuSoufowQ

    1. perez break slightly earlier
    2. perez does not turn the steering wheel left but keep going straight while the road turn slightly right. possibly to compensate for point 1and protect position (all inside the rules so far)
    3. massa does not seam to notice neither 1 and 2 and turn the steering wheel to the right like preparing for a normal track position on turn 1.
    4. massa speed is way to high anyway. at least this is what it looks like from all the videos

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    1. deancassady says:

      I reviewed the video feed, and I can’t see that Perez did anything wrong.
      Context:
      Like many people, I was excited about the prospect of a non-Mercedes driver winning this race; with Massa leading, I thought that he could pull it off, and I was hoping that he would. When he went in for new tires, I didn’t think he’d be able to do it, but when he came out, his track position was good, and with the pace and fresh rubber, he looked like he should have been able to get by Rosberg, if he’d created the opportunity.
      But he didn’t.
      Massa is a competent driver; I don’t pay much credence to the calls for him to retire because of his crash in 2009.
      But, there is a difference between a driver who can win a championship, even Button, and those that can not, and unfortunately, we have seen many times in the past that when the chips are down, something happens to Massa, and he can’t perform.
      This was another one of those cases.
      I don’t think he needs to retire, but it really looks like he made this accident all by himself.
      Of course Perez’s reputation is there, well earned; however, based on the video, he maintained his line, it is not observable any early braking, and I wonder what the telemetry indicates that he get the penalty, and not Massa.

      Danny-boy: good on you mate; I haven’t been the biggest fan, but you have proven yourself this season.

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    2. timw says:

      The off board footage I saw shows Perez clearly moving to the left, if you compare his line with Seb’s it is very different. Checo was also braking earlier than normal due to his problems, I think maybe Felipe was a bit optimistic trying the inside line but clearly Perez moved across and shouldn’t have done, it was too late to start defending.

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      1. jk says:

        Firstly, there is no rule that can punish people if they deviate from a “Seb” line. So we should stop talking about Apples and carrots when we are not even taking about potatoes.

        Secondly, Perez never changed his line. He was driving on straight, taking a different line, and maybe off the preferred racing line, even though the track turns gently to the right before T1. But again, this is no crime.

        The only crime is, massa failed to avoid the car in front.

        It was massa with a huge speed differential. It was massa who could have avoided the contact.
        Massa did not have to be there. Perez was ahead, he could choose to be wherever he wanted, as long there was no weaving, change of line twice to defend, or abrupt change of direction that cause incidents or any driving manner that puts others in danger.

        IF someone is driving towards your side of the track to crowd you out, or in another word blocking in order to defend the position from an overtake maneuver, they are entitled to do so. But not change the line twice. So what the initiator of the maneuver, being massa, needed to do was go around the outside and overtake by steering more to the left (Perez left plenty of space on the left of massa), or slow down and go to the right of Perez from behind, diving in on the inside of the gentle curve leading Yuri up to T1.

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    3. aveli says:

      massa lost control of his car. he goes left, then right under acceleration into perez.

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  50. Rohan says:

    Perez eas clearly at fault and is a danger to himself and others. Quite how anyone can claim otherwise is baffling, and anyone doing so needs their head checking out. Just like Perez.

    Disgraceful.

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    1. Voodoopunk says:

      Anyone who disagrees with you is wrong?

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    2. Elie says:

      What ,so 100 or more of us here alone need our head read but not you..There will be a man with a nice white jacket coming round any minute now..just smile hes just trying to keep you warm

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  51. Andrew H says:

    I’ll admit, when it happened live I thought it was Massa’s fault, but after watching many replays it looks like Perez did move left.

    “stewards judged that Perez had changed his racing line which caused the impact with Massa.”

    However, a 5 place grid penalty is nowhere near enough punishment for the seriousness of such an incident, I would almost liken it to the Grosjean crash in Spa.

    I think a one race ban would of have been far more appropriate.

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  52. Darth_patate says:

    Hi James and scuderia “onf1”,

    Congrats on updating the site, but I agree it’s still Jerez…it needs better contrast, all is so white

    Regarding Perez vs Massa, i would love to read Mark G comments.

    I can see Checo has a history but in 2014 and prior to this race, it seems nobody was contradicting FI’s Praises about his good racing on sundays (while asking better quali times). He was doing pretty well alongside very highly regarded Hulk. (and i think bouncing back the way he is doing after a desapointing year and being tossed away by MCL is pretty commandable)

    I also would appreciate steward to release the “data” and their analysis of it. “You have to trust steward’s ruling” is just not good enough for me :
    Just for this race, Nico Rosberg not getting a penalty can be argued (for the flat out chicane). I know my playstation stewards would give me one !!!!!

    Regarding Massa, i think he is mostly upset with himself because he lost a podium or even a win opportunity. But he did not lose it to Checo…he lost it way before. I am not expert enough to see if most of it was due the pit stop or bad strategy.

    But I have a feeling ALonso or Lewis wouls have won this race driving that Williams. What’s the feeling in the paddock ?

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    1. aveli says:

      absolutely right you are, darth_patate, perez held off both red bulls from lap 49 massa had a chance to pass vettel on lap 54 and by lap 70, he still hadn’t made a single pass. the only time he tried, he crashed into the back of perez and started to display that horrible side of his personality. he should step out and enjoy the millions he accumulated over the years. i don’t want to see him hurt.

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  53. mizzlegizzle says:

    It was a close shave for the Brazilian

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  54. aveli says:

    massa was at fault. I have seen a few of the overhead illustrations of perez moving off line.
    firstly the whole sequence is less than half a second
    secondly both massa and perez were closing on vettel and they both moved off line.
    massa smashed into perez for no reason other than he lost control of his car. he must have been acceleratin when he should have been braking.

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  55. JB says:

    So Massa is completely correct?
    He had 3 car width on the left side of the road that he could use, yet to kept his steering straight ahead and didn’t even judge the spacing between him and the car he tries to overtake.
    Perez never moved to the left, he kept his steering straight as the onboard showed.

    I’m not sure anyone needs to check their heads but perhaps you should check some facts first.

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  56. Carlos Marques says:

    I can just see Maldonado reading this thread and going “Phew, at least THAT one wasn’t my fault!”

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  57. delidimos says:

    What happent at perez facebook page for the Poll Of The Week.The question was (who was to blame for the canandian gp accident).Perez was to blame 66% and massa 24%.Then the question changed to who was the most outstanding driver of the canandian gp.

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  58. CHEESYPOOF says:

    I don’t know why Perez was penalised, he definitely was 50% at fault but Massa is always making stupid decisions under pressure. He used to get very close to Alonso at starts and I think on a couple of occasions were it not for Alonso’s awareness it would have been a collision of Ferrari team mates. This was a racing incident between two drivers who have never been able to trade with another driver fairly at top speed on any regular basis. It’s inevitable that they collide.

    The real tragedy is that Williams have two average drivers at best. Bottas is doing a decent job but were it Alonso I think we’d have a clear 2nd team. Williams are underperforming time and time again, they can’t even get pit stops right. I’m not sure if this shows how tight competition is nowadays or how weak competition was back when Williams were winning.

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  59. finster says:

    looked like a racing incident to me. Perez had brake problems. Massa radioed to the pitwall just before the incident saying he had no brakes. With Perez slowing in front of Massa, knowing he had a problem staying out of the way would be a priority. Massa was well aware of his own lack of brakes. Could be he lost them on the straight and did not yet know it, till he binned it. Luckily neither driver were injured. So the question needs to be addrssed as to this years formula. Is it too complex? I feel the FIA , particulary Todt, would have the experience to realize the cost and myriad of problems the teams would face. The millions spent on development. Then to make matters worse, not enough testing. THere should have been no penalties, except to the FIA for providing an ugly, awful sounding “power unit”.

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  60. aveli says:

    very well placed jk.

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  61. zombie says:

    I’m sorry, James, but i feel the old layout of the website was simpler, faster and easier to navigate.

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  62. aveli says:

    the stewards are bullies.

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  63. Cal says:

    Hope this image helps ppl see better what happened
    http://imgur.com/WRTu05L

    Also this new layout… can’t tell what the hell is supposed to be actual news and whats not.. As if designed to make PC users close it and move on the next site instantly

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  64. John in SD says:

    Well having watched the various replays, imho, I would still put it as a racing incident. Massa ran into the back of Perez’ car taking a shot at the position. It was an ambitious move on Massa’s part, but good for him for having a go at the beginning of the last lap. However, they both paid the price, i.e. horrifying accident and no points. I think the penalty was harsh on Perez in this case. Also, Williams should have known that Perez was having brake issues since the radio transmissions are available, and he was trying to sort out the balance. Massa’s engineer should have warned Massa to be careful about passing Perez.

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  65. aveli says:

    I think force india have had the chance to look at the evidence properly and now feel confident in presenting to the stewards.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/27928346

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