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Sebastian Vettel Disobeys Red Bull Team Orders To Take Malaysia Win
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Posted By:   |  24 Mar 2013   |  1:46 pm GMT  |  1,138 comments

Sebastian Vettel has won a tense Malaysian Grand Prix after edging out Red Bull team mate Mark Webber with a close move late in the race, after Webber had been told to turn down his engine and drive to the finish.

As Vettel attacked on lap 46 of 56, the pair almost collided several times, but the German squeezed through for the win.

Vettel apologised to Webber, but the Australian did not say that he accepted it, instead commenting that Red Bull management “protects” Vettel. Team boss Christian Horner meanwhile confirmed that Vettel had “taken things into his own hands” and disobeyed orders.

It was Vettel’s 27th career win, equalling Sir Jackie Stewart, but it was not one to celebrate as Vettel acknowledged,

“I did a big mistake today,” he said. “I think we should have stayed in the positions that we were. I didn’t ignore it on purpose but I messed up in that situation and obviously took the lead which, I can see now he’s upset, but yeah, I want to be honest at least and stick to the truth and apologise.”

But on a day when likely main title rival Fernando Alonso scored no points after crashing out on the second lap, Vettel knew that with the difference between first and second place at seven points, he did not want to gift them to Alonso.


The spat overshadowed all other stories from the day, including Lewis Hamilton taking his first podium for Mercedes in third place. Here too there was some controversy as Nico Rosberg was told not to pass Hamilton in the closing stages as the Englishman struggled with fuel consumption. Unlike Vettel, Rosberg obeyed.

After a pre-race downpour the Grand Prix begun in intermediate conditions and looked from the out-set to be a strategically dominated race that would be dictated by the cross over point to dry tyres. And this came to fruition when Vettel pitted a lap too early and handed the race lead to a fast starting Webber.

The Australian had made a contrasting start to last weekend and found himself in second position by the second lap. This was helped by the damaged Ferrari of Fernando Alonso that tagged Vettel in to turn 1 and subsequently had his front-wing fold underneath him at the same point on the following lap. That put the Spaniard out of the race and dented his Championship hopes at an early stage.

On a drying track, Vettel pitted for slick tyres too early. By staying out Webber jumped him and led from Vettel after the first set of pit stops they were joined for the battle of the race lead by the Mercedes pairing of Hamilton and Nico Rosberg. And it remained in that order until the final ten laps as Vettel and Webber came very close to the pit wall, with Vettel coming out on top. It is the 27th race win of his career, moving him in to the World Championship lead, and putting him on a par with Sir Jackie Stewart.

In an eventful race that harked back to the Summer of 2010, Vettel asked his Red Bull team to move Webber out of the way as he was “too slow” and there was a very cold atmosphere between the Red Bull drivers as they took to the podium. It is sure to be a result that will divide opinion, with some saying that this is the kind of determination you need to be a multiple World Champion and be ranked amongst the greats.

After being within a couple of seconds of one another at the mid-point the two Mercedes cars dropped back from the Red Bull pairing and got involved in their own battle in the closing laps. Interestingly, Rosberg also asked to be let past and take this place but he was firmly told by Team Principal Ross Brawn to maintain position and bring the cars home.

There was an amusing and slightly ironic moment for Hamilton when he stopped in the McLaren box at his first pit stop. Luckily for Mercedes he did not lose too much time.

Behind the top four was another strong performance for Felipe Massa and the sole Ferrari.  He had a relatively quiet race after losing out at the start and dropping back from his second place start. He had aimed to complete the race in three stops – contrary to the four of the cars ahead – but was forced in to a late stop when he had a lot of space to drop back in to.

Lotus had a contrasting result to last weekend with Kimi Raikkonen spending much of the race stuck behind a number of cars and becoming frustrated. Nevertheless, he ended the race in seventh place – just behind team mate Romain Grosjean – and gained some vital points for the Enstone squad.

Completing the top ten was Nico Hulkenberg, Sergio Perez and Jean-Eric Vergne with all three having a good race. Hulkenberg was one of Raikkonen’s main competitors and illustrated good pace throughout. Perez, meanwhile, had a lonely race and chose to pit on the penultimate lap for a set of medium tyres to claim the fastest lap.

There were some notable retirees apart from Alonso as both Force India cars had a troubled day with a number of long pit stops before retiting both cars.

Jenson Button was having a very promising performance for his struggling McLaren team in fifth place when he also retired late in the race.

Finally, Jules Bianchi continued his impressive start to the his rookie season by ending the race in thirteenth place and thirty-four seconds ahead of Charles Pic behind.

MALAYSIAN GRAND PRIX, Sepang, 56 laps
1. Sebastian Vettel Red Bull 1h38m56.681s
2. Mark Webber Red Bull + 4.298s
3. Lewis Hamilton Mercedes + 12.181s
4. Nico Rosberg Mercedes + 12.640s
5. Felipe Massa Ferrari + 25.648s
6. Romain Grosjean Lotus + 35.564s
7. Kimi Raikkonen Lotus + 48.479s
8. Nico Hulkenberg Sauber + 53.044s
9. Sergio Perez McLaren + 1m12.357s
10. Jean-Eric Vergne Toro Rosso + 1m27.124s
11. Valtteri Bottas Williams + 1m28.610s
12. Esteban Gutierrez Sauber + 1 lap
13. Jules Bianchi Marussia + 1 lap
14. Charles Pic Caterham + 1 lap
15. Giedo van der Garde Caterham + 1 lap
16. Max Chilton Marussia + 2 laps
17. Jenson Button McLaren + 3 laps
18. Daniel Ricciardo Toro Rosso + 5 laps

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1,138 Comments
  1. Craig in Manila says:

    Okay, I can sense that this is gonna be a cracker of a forum whilst this race gets digested so I’m just gonna say :

    – Well done to Lewis (I’m not much of a fan normally) for having the class to mention Nico on the podium and for being so humble about their situation re team orders etc.

    – In the final 10 laps of the race, did RBR actually do anything to try to get Seb to move back to second position ?

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    1. Sebee says:

      Would you make a 3X WDC move over for your #2?

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      1. Galapago555 says:

        For sure I wouldn’t.

        Of course, I would never pretend not to have a hierarchy on my team, with a #1 and a #2 driver.

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      2. Quercus says:

        Seems to me that Vettel has got the Michael Schumacher disease; by which I mean he doesn’t understand sportsmanship–he thinks it’s war.

        His behaviour today makes a mockery of the ‘team orders’ rule. The incidents in both Mercedes and Red Bull suggest we should revert to a ban on team orders–at least then everyone would know where we stand and the drivers could make their own minds up how they’re going to respond to whatever information they’re fed.

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      3. rplust says:

        ….and team orders make a mockery of racing and cheat the ones watching the race.

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      4. danny11 says:

        RBR team always says that they don’t have No.1 driver and that they are allowed to race. They are disgrace for the sport!

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      5. IDR says:

        RBR tell the world every time they can, they have no number 1 number 2 drivers policy.

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      6. PB says:

        If you think this is a question even worth asking, best for us not to even attempt answering it. Although, you might be interested in H Marko’s words following the GP – “we do not have preferred drivers like Mercedes do”.

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      7. Konal says:

        I would if my “#2” deserved to be in front, which he clearly did

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      8. Dazza says:

        No, I wouldn’t move him over to let the team #2 driver ahead. However, if I was that said number 2 driver, Id punt that turd Vettel into the Barrier any chance I had for the next 3 events. Watch your arse Vettel, Aussies have long memories.

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      9. forestial says:

        Yes, they should have told him to move over since his pass was flagrantly against team orders. But Horner knows he has no authority over Vettel, with Marko skulking about.

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      10. Craig in Manila says:

        My point (if unclear) was :

        It’s rather hypocritical of Mr.Horner to say that Seb was wrong to overtake when, in fact, RBR then did nothing to “undo” Seb’s mistake.

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      11. veeru says:

        +1

        also to note that, horner tried to bring up last year situation where Webber tried the same thing…

        that alone suggests that they actually are happy with this result and it was disgusting to try to even things out

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      12. roryfireplace says:

        great points Craig…myself i’ve never been a big fan of this team-order “hold station” business…far too early in the season for those shenanigans. Webber in the past has been faster than Seb and told to cool it and being a gentleman he has. not impressed with what Seb did…but please team principals…stop being such sissy’s and let the boys race for heaven’s sake! Nico should have been allowed to sweep past Hamilton…let’s let the fastest end up at the front. the momentum of both Nico and Mark has been curtailed…not fair so early in the season especially. i don’t like artifically controlled results and team orders (in the pursuit of fairness) should NEVER be instituted until one driver is out of mathmatical chances to win the WDC. cheers, all! ps. never been a big Hammy fan but i’m sure liking the ”new” one a lot more!!

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      13. CH says:

        Exactly. Horner et al can say any words they want but their actions (or lack of) say it all.
        Deja vu.

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      14. Sebee says:

        Conspiracy Theory #30! Read about it in latest analysis post. :-)

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      15. Tank says:

        @Sebee – you mean a 3x WC that relied on the assistance of Webber, Ricciardo and Vergne to take the 2012 title, yet can’t toe the party line when it doesn’t suit him? This is one of the lowest acts in GP history, akin to Pironi/Villeneuve. At least Schumacher was a team man!

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      16. John says:

        My opinion is that Seb would have never ever done that move if he was not sure that RB would accept it. I would even think that it was agreed before the race. Mark was ordered to turn down the engine in order Seb to overtake him without too much trouble. What they did not predict was that it would not go that easy, as Mark does not give up easily, and that the whole move will bring the safety of both cars in question. Mark said that he was thinking a lot in the last 15 laps. I hope that Mark will pay back RB and Seb. If the situation is reversed, Seb will not let Mark have the win to pay him back for the “mistake”. And that is what a good sportsman, a person who really believes in what he says would do in such situation.

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      17. Matt says:

        Horner’s job is to ensure he gets two cars netting maximum points as often as possible. He doesn’t care which car wins the race, as long as
        – team unity is preserved (ie it continues to be a team that develops a car well, doesn’t have drivers taking each other out etc)
        – hopefully one of them amasses enough points to win the drivers’ title.

        Webber is in many ways an ideal #2 driver – in many other teams (indeed, in this one until Vettel arrived) he comfortably could be a #1 – he’s consistent, fast, mostly plays team rules, does media well, and very rarely has an ‘off’ day that results in few points.
        For sure Helmut has a point that perhaps he doesn’t challenge for wins as often as possible (for whatever reason), but in terms of overall team harmony, he’s a very, very good signing.

        What’s the chance that during that thoughtful 15 laps Webber decided that he’s going to race the pants off Seb for the remainder of the year, meanwhile seeking a -different- seat for next year?

        What if Vettel has forced Horner’s hand to take Riccardo or Vergne for 2014 through this action? Neither seems ready; Christian might do better to organise a swapsie with Massa and Webber, or at worst see what Ron wants for Perez.

        For the sake of the meaning of the word Management, Horner needs to get Vettel under control, or risk seeing his primadonna upset the apple cart.

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      18. bearforce1 says:

        Yeah I kinda agree except that its not like Webber hasn’t ignored team orders before.

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      19. Nick says:

        You can sure as hell bet that Webber will be racing Vettel in every race from now on and will not listen if he gets told to hold station behind him, and why should he….Vettel can apologise all he likes but his actions speak louder than words.

        Webber was told to turn his engine down and drive to the finish and did as instructed, but Vettel had a massive brain fade and let his own ambition come before the team in only the 2nd race.

        I think a lot of people are forgetting that even though this has an individual award, that is also a Team Sport, it’s not a free for all anymore because now there is too much money involved to have Senna/Prost repeats.

        Its just like Massa being told to move over for Alonso, or having his engine seal broken to give Alonso a better Grid position. I saw all those incidents as bringing the sport into disrepute as much as this was.

        Horner as principal has to maximize the points that the team gets out of races above racers; and at this point Webber was the one in front near the end and to ensure they both came home for all the points they made a team call….rather than risk these two going at and having another Turkey moment.

        Either way, Webber needs to just screw team orders and play the game Vettel wants to play. Obviously he values his own glory above that of the team, so Mark should as well.

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      20. Tim says:

        Yes.
        RBR confirmed, they had agreed, that the positions after the final round of pit stops would be the way the team finished the race. If they want to favour their #1 driver they should not make such arrangements.
        To be fair to SV, he was only following the lead of his employers, who set the tone within the team, when they reneged on the Resource Restriction Agreement (allegedly).

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    2. Cakes says:

      -F1 Supremo says Lewis Hamilton asked him to find a new team
      -Two racing teams instructed their drivers not to race after 3 quarters of the race
      -One disobeyed and one didnt

      As a fan, I dont care about Vettel or Webber. I just wonder how this sport is so doctored. The next time, a driver says “It isnt over until the last lap”, I wont believe it.

      Racing fans should feel cheated.

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      1. mario says:

        “The next time, a driver says “It isnt over until the last lap”, I wont believe it.”

        i completely agree. in my opinion, the sport has been brought into disrepute.

        James Allen, will the forumla one body ‘supposedly in charge’ do something about the duisgraceful behaviour of these teams to prevent any further disrepute? Isnt there a rule against bringing the sport into disrepute?

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      2. F1racer says:

        To have an unbiased view:

        I was disgusted for the fact that after the last pit stop, the two red bulls fought close with mark establishing the lead, only for seb to mug mark a couple of laps later. Had it been for mark not turning down his engine mode, and seb passing him, it would have been fair but as it didn’t happen like that, we are all including the red bull team totally unhappy. Seb was shocked to see newey being stern to him in the podium backstage, little realizing his own folly.

        But on the other side of the coin, all can agree that it was thrilling to watch those two battle in the track and the acrimony act develop in the podium. Who was sitting at the edge of their seats watching nico restraining behind lewis?? that was an anti-climax!

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      3. Nick says:

        It is a team sport; so how is a team trying to maximize points to try and get a lead in the Constructors Title (Which is worth Hundreds of Millions of Prize Money) rather than pander to the ambitions of one driver?

        The WCC is more important to the team than the WDC, sure they like to have the double….but Im sure the sponsors would rather the team have success as a whole.

        Vettel seems to be putting his own ambition ahead of the team….when he should be doing what is best for the team, not himself.

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      4. Ernie says:

        Well, as long as I’ve been a fan of F1 (since about 1971 – in the seventies and eighties I mostly attended races in Canada some at Watkins Glen) there have been team orders – it’s part of the sport – to make sure that drivers don’t take each other out when they are in top positions. It is a TEAM sport, something Vettel has no respect for. Vettel just HAS to win – screw everyone else, and although F1 drivers are bred that way he only thinks of himself and not the team. He is the problem here and the team radio conversations (at least the ones we were allowed to hear) were clear in the fact that Vettel was to hold back – even Horner got on the radio telling Vettel not to be silly before he took Webber on corner two.
        I hope Webber continues to follow the rules as he always does, goes after Vettel with all his heart and then changes teams for next season.
        Vettel is a crybaby and very few of the drivers even have respect for the “champion”. Champions don’t act this way – but they do get away with it.
        If it wasn’t team racing – each team would only have one car and one driver.

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      5. Rudy says:

        +1

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      6. Craig Baker says:

        Why should Webber have to leave the team that he helped develop and build from Jaguar to RBR with the help of Coulthard and Newey. Demote Vettel to Torro Rosso, he won there before and if he is so good I am sure he could win there again.

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      7. richard says:

        why is there any disrepute?

        f1 racing teams can agree, decide and plan anything they wish – and drivers (and the pit and pitwall crew) can execute anything they wish – within the rules.

        in this case, seb decided he’s going to take the victory. he’s obviously a bit of a loose cannon and not a team-player for doing so, but damn it if it didn’t result in some of the finest wheel to wheel racing i’ve seen since lewis and jenson went hammer and tongs a few laps after vettel and webber collided in turkey 2010.

        why would anyone complain at this?! it’s like saying the midfielder who scored a winning goal shouldn’t have done so because the plan was for the star striker to do it.

        enjoy the fact they went racing!

        as for merc, i can understand this too – rosberg played the flipside to the coin above, effectively passing the ball to the star striker in the hope one day he might be given the opportunity himself.

        it’s a team sport – but the driver’s are what make it fun and exciting :)

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      8. Steve says:

        Time to do away with Pit to car radio I think and get back to boards hanging from the pit wall. Imagine a race where drivers have to think for themselves and have no radio..it works for the 2 wheelers and it used to work beautifully for F1 in the pre radio days.

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    3. Wayne says:

      VET was wrong, there is no excuse and no reasonable argument against this position. However, were F1 not cursed with ridiculous Pirelli tyres these guys would not be strolling around 8 tenths off their maximum pace. They would be more certain of the drivers ultimate pace around them and they could all drive accordingly. The races are being decided, not by team orders which quite rightly come into play later in the race for TEAMS to protect their investment, but in the strategy rooms. I curse they day Pirelli came into F1 (I realise they are doing what is asked of them but THEY make the tyres ultimately). I, for one, would never ever buy a Pirelli road tyre for my car on sheer bloody principle. How they think F1 is a good marketing venture for them is beyond me. If I buy a tyre for my car I want to know they’ll last through a trip to the corner shop 😉

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      1. LT says:

        I actually have/had Pirelli tyres on my car. I can say thier road tyres reflect thier race tyres……they don’t last long at all!! Not good value for the price they ask for them.

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      2. richard says:

        on a triumph daytona 675 i can heartily recommend pirelli – sticky boots indeed!

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      3. Rudy says:

        Good point here by Wayne, how does Pirelli come out in marketing terms after 2 seasons where all we listen to is tyres, tyres… Or it is a perfect example of negative remembrance in which a bad product raises consumer awareness but even then you keep the brand in your mind. We know road going Pirelli tyres are not long-lasting but what about young guys influenced by F-1 marketing. I think that’s the target.

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      4. richard says:

        i agree totally on the effect the tyres have on the racing, but there’s the counter argument everyone forgets…

        if the tyres allow flat out racing with no deg, the fastest car will always win in f1 – there’ll be no wheel to wheel racing at all…

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    4. Simmo says:

      Well, what I don’t understand is why suddenly red bull have favoured Webber this race. Seems very odd.

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      1. Nulla says:

        Red Bull normally let there drivers race each other until the final pit stops are over and then they are asked to hold position if the 2 cars are in the lead. What happened here is that the team didn’t stuff up Webber’s race enough to get Vettel back into the lead cleanly at the last pit stop. Which in the end Vettel couldn’t handle. My guess is then Webber was told not to fight back and that is how the race finished. If you look at the tyres on both cars at the end. Webber should have been in a far better position for the last 5 laps and should have been able to pass Vettel to take the win. But this could have put Vettel at risk after a tough fight to the 2 Mercedes in the final laps. At this point Mercedes would have let Rosberg past Hamliton and Red Bull could have lost a easy 1-2.

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      2. Yak says:

        It’s not about favouring one driver over the other. It’s about favouring the result for the team overall. A battle between the two of them could have killed their tyres and left them open to those behind (I would think if RB were clearly struggling, Rosberg might have been released to race), or worse led to a collision. The team had discussed what would happen in this situation, and they were told on track to just hold position and cruise to the end. If their positions had been reversed to begin with, it would have been Webber having to hold behind Vettel.

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      3. Craig Baker says:

        If you look at the WCC standings for RBR, you can use it as a barometer to see how high Mark has been allowed to climb in a race.
        After Melbourne RBR were concerned by Ferrari’s result hence giving Mark max support to assist in bringing home maximum points for the WCC.
        China will see a fired up Mark being painted as a trouble maker, and finishing off the podium still with reasonable points.
        You have seen a race strategy many times, well this is RBR’s season strategy.

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    5. AlexD says:

      It is simple, webber should never ever support vettel and I am sure that he will do everything for other people to win, but not vettel.

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      1. Brad says:

        He already does that

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    6. vicnsi says:

      Regardless of how anyone tries to spin this, (particularly Vettel supporters) this episode has hurt Vettel’s integrity quite badly, without any question whatsoever.

      Yes, he’s young & hungry; yes, he wants to win at all costs; yes we love racers who give no quarters; yes, your team mate is the competitor you most want to beat; yes, he’s apologised for his indiscretion; etc., etc., etc., etc., ad infinitum…

      The bottom line is, at the end of the day, this is only a ‘Sport’, and in Sport, there really is such a thing as a gentleman…in that being recognised as ‘gentleman’ is still a most priceless virtue. Just ask Sir Stirling Moss.

      This is very reminiscent of the sort of heated, intense & contentious rivalry (b/w Gilles Villenuve & Didier Pironi) that indirectly led Villeneuve to his death. Let’s hope this brewing Vettel/Webber rivalry doesn’t end quite as tragically, for Webber…

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    7. George says:

      Is it possible tog get telemetry and clear up the situation here? Were Red Bull trying to save engine, tyres or fuel and how is the code passed to the drivers to hold position?

      If people knew this then it would end further speculation and the actions ,intent and displeasure by the team would be confirmed.

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    8. Rob in Tas says:

      I expect the little prince and Helmut Marko would expect Mark to push him over the line in the last race of the season to win the championship.

      Our little German friend may be a 3X WDC and have a driven passion to win, but I still cant bring myself to like the man.

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    9. Andrew Carter says:

      Horner has already said that he didn’t believe Seb not doing it on purpose and felt that he’d just ignore the order, again.

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    10. Dragster says:

      +1

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    11. WHood says:

      It seems that RBR is favoring Webber now and has forgotten who brought them the TRIPLE DOUBLE!!!! Maybe its time to move on Seb and go to a team that can treat you like a TRIPLE WORLD CHAMPION!!!!!

      Come on Webber, you are no 2. It is written on your car, your cap, your race suit, including everything with your name on it!!!!

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      1. Jim McMillan says:

        But not in his contract.

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    12. Ace says:

      I think it’s time for Mark Webber to stop being Mr Nice Guy and think only of himself and the chance to bank points for the title.

      It’s clear Red Bull favour Vettel and put Webber on the side lines.

      Hopefully Mark takes this as a wake up call that Seb will do him no favours in the persuit of another title.

      This year will be Mark’s only chance to have a real go at the title again and he needs to fight back with the same attitude as Vettel.”Take no prisoners”.

      Remember the Senna – Prost battle when they were in the same team.

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    13. Jimmy says:

      Bad for F1, just makes it harder for the fans to enjoy when contrived results come into any sport. I have heard it called match-fixing and apparently people can even get fined!!! Fancy that!!

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      1. Ace says:

        Spot on !!!! That’s why an Australian betting company have decided to refund any money paid on Webber winning the race as it can be viewed as match – fixing.

        If this was a horse race the jockey would be suspended and the owners fined if not disqualified from racing.

        I say no team order regardless of standings because F1 is about individual drivers trying to win with the machinery they have and they should be free to race to the end.

        The team picks up the same glory for a win regardless of the driver.

        It was an absolute sham that 1,2,3,and 4th place were under the same orders as Niko is in the same boat as Webber.

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  2. JimmiC says:

    The baby-faced assassin. Quite ruthless from the boy, in a manner that – even given past tensions – was dramatic. Speaking as a neutral viewer with no driver bias, I actually like him more because of it.

    Two races in and we have fireworks already. Great race.

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    1. Scuderia McLaren says:

      +1

      I like Vettel more also because he raced.

      Vettel just did to webber what webber tried to do to Vettel in the British GP 2011 despite team orders then also.

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      1. Xbox 720 says:

        +3
        Good on Vettel he is the reigning world champion and play 2nd fiddle to Webber, I don’t know what Horner’s thinking, and lets make it clear Webber knew Seb was making the move he was under attack for over 2 laps and also Horner said they were on the same engine map, Redbull should never have made that order, Webber won’t be winning the title.

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      2. Craig D says:

        That is true. It’sore emotional when it’s for a win. It could be viewed as fine as long as Seb fully expects Mark to teturn the favour from now on! Whereas Rosberg would hope his taking one for the team to one day be redeemed.

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      3. Alex says:

        I’d have more respect for Vettel’s move if he’d stood by his decision to race Webber. His apology after this race put me in mind of Schumacher’s reaction after the 2002 Austrian GP: was it genuine contrition or a reaction to popular opinion?

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      4. Scuderia McLaren says:

        Agree with you Alex. The apology is the only part that is wrong in my opinion. He should own his actions and not think the fans so stupid as to not know what happened. We know, and some of us are smart enough to remember that Webber does the same thing. He should just simply say that.

        “live by the sword, die by the sword.”

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      5. Siobhan says:

        I don’t think Vettel was apologising for racing, more that he broke a gentleman agreement (multi 21). He was ok until the point that Webber joined him before the podium and said “Multi 21”.. his demeanour changed after that. I don’t fault Vettel, he raced. I was willing Rosberg to do the same with Hamilton. I don’t want to see 1/4 race where the winner is already decided

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      6. Alan says:

        Excellent point!

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      7. Wayne says:

        No its not an excellent point. Unlike today, there was no agreement that both drivers had signed up to before the British GP, they sprung that on WEB mid race. This is very different if you think it through.

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      8. veeru says:

        it is not so excellent when both the drivers were asked to turn down the engines and run to finish, except the boy wonder chose to ignore it..

        if that is excellent in your book, please use the word ever so rarely

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      9. eduardo says:

        you do know that webber´s car was tuned down during the race right? i think that is the most important part everyone is leaving out

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      10. Michael S says:

        I agree… Webber has stated over and over again that he will not listen to team orders to let Vettel win. Last year when Vettel was up for the title Massa helped Alonso a ton, but Webebr said no way to that….

        I am not a fan of team orders at all. With that said… Mark cannot have it both ways. If he would have helped Vettel last year instead of racing him hard then I would say Vettel is in the wrong today.. However, he does not help so don’t expect help today…

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      11. Wade Parmino says:

        In the 2011 British GP Webber ceased his attack on Vettel as soon as team orders were given.

        Foolish diplomatic decision on Vettel’s part. At any point in the future Vettel is leading and Webber is in 2nd place but has enough pace to pass, he most certainly will regardless of what the team orders. Vettel has just shown Webber that he has no respect for team procedures (multi 21) and now the gloves are definitely off. On the podium Webber’s demeanor was just like Gilles Villenueve’s after the 1982 Imola race.

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      12. IDR says:

        Overtake your team mate meanwhile he is driving according to team orders that you are not obeying is not racing.

        You could or could not agree with team orders, but if one of them is under team orders and the other not, this is not real racing, this is an unfair advantage taken by one of them.

        No honor in this days we are living…

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      13. **Paul** says:

        Indeed that’s exactly what I thought of too. Red Bull were roundly slated after that race for preferential treatment of Vettel, who was already well in control of the championship. So quite why Mercedes aren’t the bad gus today is puzzling, I can only put this down to driver bias from media/fans. Rosberg was evidently quicker and had the sufficent fuel to stay on it. I think we can assume Lewis has a preferential treatment clause in his contract.

        Was Vettel right to ignore team orders, following the path of Webber and Button? Yes in my opinion. He’s there to win, it’s not sporting, it’s not very nice and its not going to help his relationship with Mark, but I believe the greats in modern F1 would all have done the same. Senna, Prost, Schumacher and Alonso… Look at what they’ve got in common and the answer is titles. To be the best sometimes you have to be nasty.

        F1 is a harsh world, and I think casual fans will struggle with the above. I do feel for Mark, but nice guys rarely finish first in F1.

        One final point, the battles between the Red Bulls and Mercedes were great action, as a fan that’s what I love to see, drivers going toe to toe in equal cars, hence my delight that Massa is also back on form.

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      14. Just because the so-called “greats” have acted like that in the past doesn’t make it the right thing to do. Vetted can win all the world titles he wants but they will be hollow victories that no-one respects. And I wish he would stop putting up that finger at the end. He was not the best driver on the day. Mark had more than his measure and believed they were driving to team orders (and I am someone who is realistic about their existence in the sport – if I was paying $50M+ a year I would expect to call the shots to ensure a safe 1 – 2). Karma may bite Vettel on the backside at some point in the future as he took more life out of the engine than was needed.

        What itnHAS done, though, is spiced this up a lot. Can’t wait to see how it all plays out. However, I have my suspicion that Webber will suffer many mysterious mechanical gremlins and bad starts this year, particularly if he qualifies beside, or worse – dares to out-qualify, Vettel.

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      15. Bomber says:

        Fangio, Clarke, Stewart, Graham Hill, Piquet, Fittipaldi would never have done what Vettel did.

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      16. **Paul** says:

        @Bomber, you’ve got to be kidding about Piquet! The man who paid for bad press to be printed about Mansell’s family to gain the upper hand?

        Ther others you mention wouldn’t have done it, I grant you, but we’re talking modern F1 here. It’s no gentlemans sport, it’s a business. Just like other big sports. A shame yes, but also true!

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      17. pawan says:

        oh thats right.. they would never do that…. they only take their team mates car instead…

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      18. Kili Liam says:

        Excellent point! x2

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      19. newton says:

        I think it’s a bit weasely to do that and then be so apologetic afterwards. Like they say, NEVER APOLOGISE, NEVER EXPLAIN.
        Man up and admit that you were dastardly.

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      20. Mikey moos says:

        Excellent point????? At Silverstone Mark showed he was quicker then backed off, as per instructions from the team.
        Seb simply disobeyed team orders and should be penalised for it.
        It was absolutely nothing like Silverstone. Get the Seb blinkers off please,

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      21. Ahmed says:

        IN British GP 2011, Webber did not listen to team orders, he attacked Vettel until the final lap, and Vettel held him off and finished just ahead of Webber. Webber has never been a team player, and refuses to accept that Vettel is better than him, despite 3 world titles to Vettels name.

        The definition of a team player is Massa, have a look at how he supported Alonso at the tail end of 2012, staying out longer on strategy, pushing webber to the outside, and giving Alonso the inside to overtake 2 positions in Brazil 2012 etc. Webber will never do this, and has constantly stated the he will never play a support role or listen to team orders, which is pretty selfish. So you get back what you put in Mr Webber.

        To all the Vettel haters, one question, if it were Webber that defied team orders and overtook Vettel, would there be the same uproar, or would you call him a legend???

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      22. Simon Donald says:

        +1000. What Seb did was exactly what he tried to do in Turkey a couple of years ago, driving far too aggressively against his teammate. He’s just lucky he didn’t gift Lewis Hamilton another victory as he did then!

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      23. **Paul** says:

        Because finishing 4 tenths behind your team mate is ‘backing off’ ?! I think you need to rewatch those final 5 laps or so Sir !

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      24. H Bailey says:

        this is the thing that happens when a person is feed with a silver spoon.They become a brat and act like that. Vettel was groomed for the sport he wouldnt understand what its like to have to really fight and earn something.

        F1 is losing its way.

        The tyres are making the sport so boring.

        People like Alonso because he is the champion of the fans and vettel is the champion of the machine. He will never in my eyes be classed as the best ever.Win as many titles as you want

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      25. Nigel says:

        Except he didn’t race; it’s fairly clear that he tricked his teammate.

        The two raced aggressively and fairly after Webber’s last pit stop, and Webber held on to the lead (despite being on colder tyres). The team then instructed both drivers to turn down their engine settings. Webber did so; Vettel deliberately ignored the instruction (as he later acknowledged), and effectively mugged his teammate for position.

        I’m not a huge fan of team orders, but in a situation like this where the team had genuine doubts about the tyres ability to last the stresses of a battle to the finish, they are understandable. If a driver isn’t going to follow them in these circumstances, then he owes the team and his teammate some notice of that.
        Webber’s and the team’s surprise at Vettel’s actions was blatantly obvious.

        It is one thing refusing team orders; it is quite another to use your ignoring of a team instruction as a way to gain advantage over a teammate who is following the identical instruction.

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      26. Syd says:

        Agree totaly.

        If both race on equal terms, then no issue.

        Webber turned his engine down, at the instruction of the team, only to be mugged from behind. A cowardly act.

        I recall occasions where Webber has been told to back off, and has done so.

        I like the taste of the drink, but RedBull has left a bitter taste in Webbers mouth !!

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      27. Andrew Carter says:

        Except Webber followed those orders.

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      28. Scuderia McLaren says:

        Wrong. He didnt follow orders, Ge simply failed to do what Seb did. The world is angry cause Seb simply made it stick despite almost being put in the wall. Funnily enough, Webber was most vocal about Schuey doing that to Barri in Hungary a few years ago. Hypocrite. Happy to see that Seb kept his foot down and showed the size of his balls is a match for his talent.

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      29. Kimi4WDC says:

        “Please tell Mark, I’m racing him” – if that was Vettel’s respond then I would agree with you. Otherwise, considering his experience and all his titles, that was a pity showing on Vettel’s behalf.

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      30. Siobhan says:

        Redbull had also 10 laps to tell Vettel what he did wrong and maybe Webber could have had that place back but they let it go to the very end and told him as he was getting on the podium… Mark should have been on to his engineers as Hamilton had done in the past with Button “I thought we were not race”.. “are you sure he understands and is not going to attack”… Mark let it go until the very end.

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      31. Scuderia McLaren says:

        Love the name- I am rooting for Kimi this year.

        Good point about Vettel stating intent. His actions on track I think we’re clear. Webber can’t really claim surprise, but you are right. Vettel should have said “Nope, sorry boys, but I’m going for it.”

        Personally, I still think Webber was clear about what Vettel was doing.

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      32. rplust says:

        Webber and all his fans should stop whining. Where was his support in the last race in Brasil when Vettel’s Championship was at stake and he needed every point? Nowhere! Webber finished 4th, Vettel 6th! I haven’t seen neither Sebastian complaining nor Horner saying a word. Besides this is supposed to be F1 racing not cruising. It’s also a shame that Rosberg degraded himself to the number 2. Develope some back bone guys, points win championships, nothing else. I’m not a fan of Schumacher but he learned early enough to ignore critics.

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    2. Wayne says:

      So, just to check – you like someone more when they break a trust with their team mate and disobey their employer? Why, because he is an F1 driver it is ok to have no honour or sportsmanship? They can do anything they like to win – is that it?

      These two had an agreement before the race started. I hate the idea that people idolise those that act despicably just because they are a celebrity. What he did was plain wrong, even he knows it on some level,

      It was wrong for the team also. How does Webber react later in the season when he cannot trust the guy he is driving at 200mph against? If he is in front he cannot trust VET to play the team game so he has to push and wear out his tyres or they collide. If he is behind he does not listen to the team because he knows his team-mate will not – so he pushes, they both wear out their tyres out or they collide.

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      1. JimmiC says:

        There is no trust there – never was. I suspect Webber was expecting an attack all along. The deliberate disobeying of a team order is the wider bone of contention.

        Just to be clear I think what Seb did was, as I said in my original post, completely ruthless. That’s not the same as me saying he did a good thing. The reason I like him more after this incident is because it is the last fragment of this easy going, humble persona removed. Seb’s crossed the rubicon now and shown himself to be a winner, at all costs. Despite everything that has come before – the Silverstone front wing mess, crashing into Webber – we have a different World Champion this morning. The dryness in his voice when he asked for Webber to be moved aside was laced with contempt.

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      2. rplust says:

        Well, if you are in favor of fixing the races, I’m in favor of abolishing the F1. They shall pack and go home! Not interested in BS! And I’m sure many viwers see it the same way.

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    3. IgMi says:

      While I am a driver fan (rather than a team fan) I always consider F1 to be a team sport (although I am not a big fan of team orders). I find “taking matters into ones own hands” to justify ones own ego while putting the team result at risk extremely disrespectful to hundreds of people who work long hours to make the team successful. I would not accept the justifications that somebody is being a “racing driver”. Vettel lost a lot in my eyes today. “Apology not accepted.”

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    4. ACx says:

      Ironically, it was the best I’ve seen Vettel fight.

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      1. HRC says:

        Right! When the other guy has one hand tied behind his back.
        What part of dialling back on the engine don’t you get.
        With all his success, Vettel is weaving a legacy of doubt about his true abilities.

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      2. Ciao says:

        You can’t determine who fought best without knowing the engWebbine and KERS settings. Given Webber’s outright pace on the red tyre all weekend vs Vettel, and Vettel running white scrubs that had an additional two more laps on them at the change, who would think that Webber didn’t have the pace to either fight off Vettel or take him again. I believe Webber was snookered by his contract and he did a mighty job fighting Vettel on the settings he was allowed by team orders.

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      3. Jonathan says:

        mmmm so Vettel’s best fight is against a team mate whose engine is turned down and told he won’t be challenged…?

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    5. Stef says:

      Vettel raced and got the victory. Webber obeyed and got second. That’s the end of it.

      Good on Vettel for telling the team to get stuffed with team orders while he was racing. That’s what I want to see. I wish he hadn’t apologized afterwards.

      The racer won, and no F1 fan can have a problem with that.

      As a side note: why did Webber try to defend so strongly when he knew that Vettel wasn’t allowed to overtake? He tried his best and still got out-raced…

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      1. Scuderia McLaren says:

        +1

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      2. Mike J says:

        “”The racer won, and no F1 fan can have a problem with that.

        As a side note: why did Webber try to defend so strongly when he knew that Vettel wasn’t allowed to overtake? He tried his best and still got out-raced…””

        You mean the racer won when he passed a team mate who had turned his engine down after the team told him too. Yeh, real racer there. I cannot see any dignity in a win when you beat your team mate who has one armed tied behind his back. Don’t think he was out raced there.

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      3. Magos says:

        +1

        I thought webber had no rear-view mirrors!

        Seb like Senna Imola 89! great

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      4. Jonathan says:

        they say luck will out… which should mean Vettel will have an engine failure ‘cos he refused to turn it down today. Racing for a championship is about more than winning one race – especially if an engine must last 3 races.

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      5. Quercus says:

        I’m sure Vettel and Webber were told to turn down their engine power for a reason. If there’s any justice in this world, in not following the team orders to turn down his engine, he’ll have over-stressed it. He won the race but just maybe his decision will come back to bite him later in the season.

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      6. Marc says:

        Lets hope he has stressed the engine

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      7. Richard Chen says:

        Eh?

        the only reason seb was in a position to challenge mark at the end was because mark had turned his engine down. Seb did not.

        Hardly fair

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      8. Bomber says:

        So next time Vettel tells his team he’s coming in to change tyres I suggest they don’t and show him what it means to be part of a team.

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    6. SteveH says:

      @JimmiC – let me get this straight: The RBR drivers have an agreement about finishing the race in position. Webber has turned down his engine, on command of the team, and Vettel, against specific orders and the team mates agreement, jumps him and steals the race. Vettel’s actions are despicable and dishonest; who will ever trust him again? He knew what he was doing was wrong on many levels and still did it. His ‘explanation’ and ‘apology’ were both self serving and lying. Instead of increasing my respect for him Vettel, by his actions, has made me actively dislike him. I think the team should not let him race the next race.

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    7. Jeff says:

      What you are saying would be correct if it was a fair fight. But Marks car was turned down so really Sebastian was just a bully. Today was the first time since Turkey 2010 that I have disagreed with a call by Sebastian.

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    8. BillyW says:

      Was it really a fair fight if Webber had turned down his engine?

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    9. Tm says:

      +1 JimmiC.

      Vettel made the race exiting and made it a great race that we will all remember for some time. Without it the race wouldn’t have been as entertaining for us fans and thats what we want, entertainment.

      Vettel was faster, so therefore deserved to win.

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      1. Poyta says:

        Vettel was only faster because he didn’t turn down the engine like Mark did – who knows if he would be faster if Mark didn’t – he certainly couldn’t catch up to to Mark for most of the race when they both had the opportunity to actually race. . Stolen win I say – I have no issues with letting them fight and may the best man win but it wasn’t a fair fight in this case.
        Shame Seb Shame.

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      2. Gate 21 says:

        It’s a pity your definition of “faster” doesn’t quite match the data.

        Maybe you believed Vettel’s complaints during the race (over the radio) that he was faster than Mark, yet immediately after began dropping time to Webber.

        Vettel blew a sizeable lead on inters when he stopped early for slicks. Webber was “faster” that is why he made up such a deficit to lead after the first stops.

        Webber led more laps of the race than Vettel. Vettel tried to catch and pass Webber for the entire race up to that point (on equal footing) and was unable to.

        Webber had a lead of 3 seconds at the time when Vettel pitted for his final stop.

        When both stops were completed Webber was STILL in the lead – albeit with a much smaller lead than before the final stop. But he defended his position fairly for the outlap.

        Webber was ordered to turn the engine down and limit use of KERS do so. Vettel was given the same order and did not. That is why he made the pass stick.

        It took Webber nursing the car UNDER INSTRUCTION FROM THE TEAM for Vettel to get past.

        There is no “faster” about it.

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      3. mario says:

        absolutely a top response. couldn’t have put it better myself.

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      4. Ahmed says:

        Vettel was clearly faster, he was all over Webber’s gearbox, and this allowed both Hamilton and Rosberg to close in on both Red Bulls.

        Vettel was better on his tyres, and made the softs last longer than Webber did on the hard set.

        Vettel easily got within 1 second, and his engineer told him “we’re only half distance” i.e. be patient, you will have more chances later. Vettel backed off to save his tyres and get out of the turbulent air as he could see that Mercedes pace was dropping off at the end of their stints.

        Vettel was patient for the whole race, Webber held him up, caused Vettel to lose a position to Hamilton and almost to Rosberg. Vettel responded, overtook Hamilton and went after Webber.

        Make no mistake Webber was fighting very aggressively and turned on full power settings, as can be seen by his straight line speed. Vettel could not even pass him with DRS. Vettel pulled off a stunning overtake around the outside of turn 4. End of story.

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    10. MikeW says:

      -1. Disagree.

      While it looks like the boy was racing, it was really a sucker punch. No respect for doing *that*

      To me, Schumacher isn’t “the greatest” because of the way he behaved in getting his WDC. Vettel is going the same way at degrading his successes.

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      1. Bomber says:

        Hear Hear!

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      2. John says:

        So who is the greatest.. Senna was jst as ruthless as schumacher, the greats of the sport all have something in common…. They will do anything to win,its part of their make up and no accident they are multiple champions.

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  3. Nasi says:

    James has any notice of the f1 paddock been given to footage of Webber flipping off Vettel during the race, it’s circling around facebook in Australia
    http://m.youtube.com/watch?sns=tw&v=DJrctaOrjvk&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DDJrctaOrjvk%26sns%3Dtw
    and an image as well:
    http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7209/dwm2013032407563244avis.jpg

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    1. Phil H. says:

      hahaha 😀

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    2. Kili Liam says:

      Nice …

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    3. Cammage says:

      Justified. In what could be Webber’s last year in F1, why would he now do as he is told. Clearly his best chance of winning a maiden title is to do what’s best for himself and just go for it!

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    4. MrNed says:

      Not sure if you’re suggesting that the stewards should impose sanctions for such behaviour? If so then don’t you think the stewards have more important things to do than get involved in handing out punishments for drivers being slightly rude to each other?

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      1. Nasi says:

        Nah the stewards should definitely not get involved, was just trying to highlight how rubbish Vettel’s excuses were that he ‘made a mistake’ and he’s ‘sorry’ – Webber seems to think it was all very deliberate. So it doesn’t matter what they say after the race, in the heat of the moment the true feelings come out between the two like when Vettel did the ‘crazy’ finger gesture to Webber in Turkey a few years back

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    5. Carlos Marques says:

      I’m sure Webber was just telling Vettel “Hey, I was supposed to be no. 1!”

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    6. I can’t believe that Sky felt the need to censor it in a replay. It’s not the first time we’ve seen drivers make such gestures (though it’s been a good few years) and broadcasters have never seen the need to blockify it before.

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      1. Tim says:

        broadcasters have never seen the need to blockify it before…

        Is that the same as censorising? :-)

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      2. It’s a specific method of censoring…

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      3. Tim says:

        Are you sure you didn’t just invent it? :-)

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    7. Joe S says:

      I think that was Mark’s version of the “Vettel Victory” finger!

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  4. James Noble says:

    James, do you think Sebs actions today will impact on Webbers future in Formula one. Now in his mid-30’s, Mark probably has little options to stay competitive outside of Red Bull.

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    1. Iker Gernika says:

      What about Ferrari, Massa is useless, he only can fight against his own team mate… better than last year, but useless anyway

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    2. W Johnson says:

      Webber has seen the writing on the wall for a number of years at Redbull. It now seems that he had the option to go to Ferrari and perhaps he should have taken it but I guess he would have been the unfavoured, “supporting no 2” driver behind Alonso. I guess he seen as a great team driver, not the same light as those with the killer selfish instinct as Hamilton, Alonso or Vettel that makes them winners!

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      1. Simon Donald says:

        As opposed to the unfavoured number 2 at Red Bull?? I loved Mark’s not so subtle dig at Helmut Marko when he said he be supported as per usual!

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  5. Laurence H says:

    WOW!

    It’s my understanding that the teams can keep any of their radio transmissions private if they want. Why, then, did Red Bull and Mercedes allow all the team order stuff to go out? Great for us, but a PR own goal as it gives the press all the info they need to start raking muck straight after the race. Easier to put a spin on what happened if the press are speculating on who said what to who.

    Anyway, as I said, great for us watching! It’s going to be a long three weeks…

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    1. Kay says:

      “It’s my understanding that the teams can keep any of their radio transmissions private if they want.”

      That’s not the case since some seasons ago.

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    2. Simmo says:

      Well, as I understand it, the FIA get all radio messages, and can supply some to FOM, or something like that.

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    3. IJW says:

      It’s my understanding, that all messages are in the clear. The FOM decides what it actually broadcasts on the TV (which is probably all the juicy stuff!).

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    4. No the teams can’t keep their transmissions private. Why, as you say, would they let them go out if they had the choice?

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      1. jorge says:

        I’ve read somewhere that teams use severe badmouthing to keep some transmissions from reaching the public.

        Would that keep teams unable to spy each other?

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      2. AJ says:

        From what I’ve read, if the team wants to keep a radio transmission private, they just make sure to drop an f-bomb so it’s unfit for broadcast.

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    5. Helenka says:

      Teams supply all the feed to FOM who then decide what is aired. They do indeed air all the juicy stuff but not anything with swear words, which is what some drivers do to stop it being aired out, or in the case of alonso speak in Italian/ Spanish so no one understands

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  6. blackmamba says:

    I applaud Mercedes for getting their priorities right. Last year the team was very mediocre and already Lewis has brought them valuable points and are actually fighting for race victories with the Bulls no less. Just his presence has raised morale, enthusiasm and motivation which naturally brings out performance in everybody. Most people would put their money on Lewis having the best chance of moving up the table championship wise so it makes sense to keep him ahead of Nico, tough as it may be on him.

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    1. Cliff says:

      Understand some of your thinking, but how does making Nico Rosberg hold position after only two races raise his morale or that of his mechanics, and where is his motivation? For the first time since 2010 Mercedes appear to have built a competitive car, surely Nico Rosberg deserves the chance to show what he can do?

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      1. MelB says:

        Well said.

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      2. Sami says:

        I am a stubborn Lewis fan, but you are absolutely right, Nico deserved the podium. Honour to Lewis for his statements after the race.

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      3. shankar says:

        +1

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      4. Wade Parmino says:

        It’s not as if they told him to let Hamilton past. He was simply to hold position.

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      5. Schumilewis says:

        I think Mercedes were worried that Hamilton would defend they way he always does and lose 3rd & 4th. Vettel knew Webber wouldn’t defend robustly enough to scare Vettel off.

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      6. Timmay says:

        It is no more competitive than the car which won the Chinese GP – and I still expect them to slide down the championship table with focus on 2014 as the excuse.

        Total votes:
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      7. Aey says:

        I am Lewis fan, but Nico had already shown to the world what he can do, even he wasn’t allowed to pass on track.

        at this race everyone know who is obviously faster.

        Total votes:
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      8. hero_was_senna says:

        You forgotten how Mercedes started last season?
        Rosberg qualified on pole and won the Chinese GP and MSC would have started on pole in Monaco?

        It’s their development that is in question.

        Total votes:
        0

      9. Grant H says:

        Agree cliff, nico was faster, merc should have told ham to move over, nice to see Lewis humble after race

        Total votes:
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      10. Quercus says:

        From what was said by Ross Brawn, it appears both the Mercedes cars were under-fuelled. If he had not told them both to back off, they would have fought it out and one or other might not have had enough fuel left to supply the required amount to the scrutineers following the race.

        What Lewis and Nico did was very mature; a statement that some might interpret as a dig at another driver.

        Total votes:
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      11. Jake says:

        Here is a theory for you:
        Ross to Lewis
        Lewis, go put some pressure on the Red Bulls, see what happens.
        Lewis to Ross
        Love to do that Ross but I don’t have the pace of the Red Bull and I could end up low on fuel if I have to turn up the engine performance.
        Ross to Lewis
        Don’t worry Lewis we have 3 and 4 in the bag, there is no serious challenge from behind and we may be able to pressure one of the Red Bulls into a mistake, tyre degradation or even mechanical failure. We have nothing to lose and could gain a place.
        Lewis to Ross
        Ok Ross if you say so but won’t that leave me open to attack from Nico?
        Ross to Lewis
        Do I look like CH I am team boss and I call the shots Nico will not be allowed to take advantage.

        Total votes:
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    2. **Paul** says:

      Whilst I agree Lewis has raised moral, so has Lauda, Wolf and co. the biggest boost though is that the car designed prior to Lewis arriving is pretty darn good.

      Todays actions though was no better than Red Bull or Ferrari holding their faster car back because they prefer the other driver. F1 is a team sport, but to call team orders on race 2 of the season? That’s pretty crap and I can only assume Lewis has some sort of clause in his contract, hence he felt pretty rubbish on the podium for calling on it so early in the season. He’s a winner though, like Vettel and they along with Alonso will do all they can to win. Sorry Nico, today proved you’re a number 2, don’t expect that favour back…ever!

      Total votes:
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    3. Vantro says:

      What we saw between the Mercedes drivers was the ugly ugly face of formula1. One thing is to decide no racing between team mates after the last pit stop, I do not particulary like that. It is however much uglier when someone is denied to pass his team mate when they was not racing. Lewis was not competitive at that point and he was not racing Nico. This was extremely ugly.

      A totally different situation between the Red Bulls drivers they was both competitive and if they had an prerace agreement was Vettels behaviour not acceptable.

      Total votes:
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    4. gudien says:

      How many ‘favors’ does Lewis need?

      At McLaren the CEO, Ron Dennis gave Lewis preferential treatment vs. Alonso and Kovalainen.

      Bernie Eccleston attempting to arrange transfer to Red Bull for Lewis.

      Now at Merc the Team Principal, Ross Brawn won’t allow Lewis’ teammate to pass.

      Senna never needed this kind of help!!!!!!

      Total votes:
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      1. Chris Chong says:

        Senna had God behind him, apparently.

        Total votes:
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      2. Cos says:

        @ gudien …so what you are telling me is; you find a talented child, nurter him, invest in him so that he becomes a star driver and then call it all doing ‘him’ a favour?? like you won’t be getting anything out of the deal

        Regarding the most recent ‘favour’ I think you may be missing the bigger pictre – that being, if the two Mercedes were allowed to race to the end, one would have less fuel (probably Hamilton) for the end of race inspection / or might stop on track…this would end up with the Team being penalised by fines and penalties for the next race and probably Mercedes losing curcial points in the Constructors Championship.

        Oh and before you start making references to Hamilton not being able to judge his fuel load…Merc didn’t plan for this kind of race – i.e. being in a position to chase down the Red Bulls in the closing stages…this is where he burnt most of his fuel…with Nico chasing Lewis down, Nico may have been running a bit low too.

        True Senna never needed this kind of help, but that was a different era and team orders were still being used

        Total votes:
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    5. hero_was_senna says:

      Poor Aldo Costa, and the rest of the tech team. It was Lewis that makes the difference..

      Total votes:
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      1. Elie says:

        In his defence Lewis was nothing short of praises for the team for giving him a good car. Whereas certain others whine about a bad car even when their in podium– & you know who I mean don’t you

        Total votes:
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  7. Peter says:

    I like Webber, but I hate team orders. Let them RACE, I do not care if the tires or the engine break down I do not want to see cars proceedings in an order for the last ten laps. The race between Mark and Seb was actually quite good. Also its shame Nico was not allowed to overtake, if Hamilton fuel was short its his problem, let Nico finish on the podium.

    Total votes:
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    1. Craig D says:

      Yes, it’s great for us but teams can’t take such liberties with millions of pounds at stake.

      Total votes:
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    2. Kay says:

      Had they raced, then Webber would’ve still won because he was racing until he was ordered to turn down the engine.

      So either way, Webber’s robbed by Vettel.

      Total votes:
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    3. Wayne says:

      Teams invest 300 million dollars in a season of F1 and you want them to sacrifice that investment for….what? The team actually gets a huge amount of money for the Constructors championship and you want them to risk that for what…….?

      F1 is a TEAM sport, it’s such a simple concept that fans of other sports can easily comprehend – why is it so difficult for F1 fans to get their head around?

      No team should go into a season favouring one driver but at the end of a race or at a certain point in the season it makes nothing but good sense to back the leader or protect their points haul. They race every other driver on the circuit, that’s plenty of racing in every GP. The idea that team orders spoils F1 does not make sense.

      Total votes:
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      1. Kimi4WDC says:

        This kind of racing wont make any headlines. Do you want to go back and rethink how much did F1 brand rose due to rivalries went all out?

        Total votes:
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    4. Anne says:

      Team orders will always be around one or another.

      Total votes:
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    5. Richard says:

      They were both low on fuel through aggressive fuel strategy, but Lewis did more in the race so I expect his fuel situation to be more critical than Nico’s. From the teams perspective they did the right thing, and the drivers obeyed which is a far better result than either or both of them not having enough fuel to get through the FIA test at the end.

      Total votes:
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      1. John says:

        Did more? How was that? Nico overtook people and held onto Hamilton quite easily with a lean fuel mix, so no Nico did more and Nico was faster, but I suspect he’s been shattered by this.

        Total votes:
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      2. Richard says:

        Nico was overtaken by Button at the start. Hamilton drove quite an aggressive race in the early keeping up with the Bulls and challenging them, but he was put into fuel saving mode quite early on and then could do little more. Rosberg drove a more controlled race and was able to keep up because Hamilton was fuel saving. Ross Brawn did exactly the right thing because both cars were running out of fuel and had they raced to the end would have most likely failed the FIA test. One can understand Rosberg’s emotions but in the current formula it’s not always possible. Gary Anderson also confirmed that Ross had done the right thing if you listened properly. Rosberg will have his chances in the future races and he understood eventually the team orders were in place, and all credit to him for obeying which is more than I can say for that lousy sportsman Vettel.

        Total votes:
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    6. [MISTER] says:

      “Let them RACE, I do not care if the tires or the engine break down I do not want to see cars proceedings in an order for the last ten laps.”

      It’s not you who pays the bills, is it?

      Total votes:
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      1. shankar says:

        I think our cable cost and ticket cost that pays their bill. doesn’t it? so shouldn’t the sport do justice to the fans money?

        overtaking artificially with unrealistically degrading pirellies and DRS and now blatant team orders don’t make it very exciting. does it. this is not F1. NASCAR and V8’s produce better races.

        I defenitely would love team work when clearly one driver is out of contention for the championship, but not what is happening for massa’s, rosberg’s and webber’s now, making them number 2 right from the start. i really dont know how can these guys accept it and do it at all.

        Total votes:
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      2. Anne says:

        No team wants a broken engine. Remember that they have a limited number of engines they can use. If they break that rule they get a penalty

        Total votes:
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      3. Those who watch on Pay TV actually do fund the teams, so you never know.

        Spectators on the ground only fund the circuit and FOM.

        That said, team orders have always been, being disguised with.more or less tact, up until 2010.

        Letting them race when they are on different technical strategy makes no sense either, and that’s .of racing either.

        Total votes:
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      4. BadMoles says:

        Actually, yes he does pay the bills – in a roundabout sort of way.

        Without viewers like us there would be no sponsors, without sponsors there would be no money, without money there is no teams.

        Total votes:
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      5. roryfireplace says:

        right on Charlie Brown!! :)

        Total votes:
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      6. John says:

        Well Mister, I agree with you. Let them race and whoever wins wins. If it would be so there would be no situation between Mark and Seb. Not that I care about either one of them or RB.

        Total votes:
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      7. [MISTER] says:

        I think you misunderstood my comment.
        I was quoting Peter.

        Total votes:
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    7. Aey says:

      You don’t care, but the team care.

      Total votes:
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    8. Jonathan says:

      it would seem you can only think one race at a time. What you suggest is fine for one race but in order to put a championship bid together the teams and drivers have to remember that an engine may have to be used for 3 races. If they race to the bitter end … they would only enter 8 races!

      Here’s hoping Vettel’s red mist comes back to haunt him!

      Total votes:
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  8. Sasa says:

    One of the most sickening race in recent history.
    Would Seb have gotten so close to Mark after the final pit stop if they decided to pit Mark first?
    I supposed they pitted Seb first to ensure that he finished ahead of Lewis, which is why I think in exchange for that, RBR wanted them to stay in their positions.

    As for Mercedes, I guess they wanted to make up for the team’s mistake for un-fueling Lewis’ car.

    Total votes:
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    1. Sebee says:

      They put Seb on slicks too early. Once people cool off they will realize this was the correct outcome.

      Total votes:
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      1. Danny Almonte says:

        Sob used up all his inters in qualifying. He had no choice. Try again.

        Total votes:
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      2. Wayne says:

        Correct outcome for who? Certainly not for the team, and F1 is a TEAM sport. The team get the same points whatever way round they finish – only now they have a situation were neither driver has the trust on the other to honour agreements so how do they react next time?. 42 points were risked today for the sake of ego by a kid who has no respect or honour. These two drivers had an agreement, they said as much, that should not be overlooked just because these men happen to be F1 drivers.

        Total votes:
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      3. Sebee says:

        Exactly. They got their 43 points. So what’s the problem?

        Can I put this into perspective for you? Vettel is going for 4th in a row. Historic stuff. If Webber’s feelings get hurt, so be it. 4th is the goal. When Webber is going for 4th he’ll have my support.

        And as I told you, why are you so upset about this?

        First Lewis would have won if they crashed out.

        Second, we got action and drama.

        Third, nothing illegal or against the rules happened.

        Fourth, Vettel is known to race to the end and set fastest laps end of race.

        Fifth, how gullible is Mark to think Vettel was going to back off on faster tires after the stunts he pulled on Vettel.

        He’s just sore because he’s been had. Nothing against the rules happened here. I have a new conspiracy theory. #30 in latest post. :-)

        Total votes:
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      4. Phil says:

        Did they? Or was that Seb’s decision, thinking he’d ensure he stayed out in front?

        Total votes:
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      5. Miha Bevc says:

        I think it was Vettel’s decision to pit too early. He’s been told over the radio that they are ready whenever he thinks he is ready to take the slicks. He had bad pitstop timings today (except for the last pit stop).

        But don’t get me wrong, I like the outcome!

        Total votes:
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      6. Cliff says:

        But if you remember, Rocky left the decision so Seb.

        Total votes:
        0

      7. I think it’s Roque, Guillaume Roquelin’s nickname.

        Total votes:
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      8. Doug says:

        I wonder if you’ll have the same opinion if Mark drives Seb of the circuit in China?

        I thought the driver of the day was JB…really making the most of a much improved McLaren…he could have been 3rd/4th or 5th depending on how much Merc. had slowed due to their low fuel.

        Back to the Bulls, I do think Horner should have got on the radio & said “If you don’t let Mark re-take you…you’ll be sitting out China”!
        I have no preference either way for Mark or Seb…but the team makes the calls…the drivers should listen.

        Total votes:
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      9. HRC says:

        Well, I guess we will find out who runs the team – Christian or Sebastion.

        Total votes:
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      10. Wade Parmino says:

        Absolutely right!

        Total votes:
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      11. Andrew M says:

        Horner comes across as pretty toothless in all of this. “Seb, this is silly, come on” sounds like something I might say to my 3 year old nephew, not a disobedient employee.

        Total votes:
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      12. Aey says:

        Seb just can’t accept when he is behind Mark. He just want to show who is the boss.

        Total votes:
        0

      13. Andrew Carter says:

        +1

        Total votes:
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      14. Scuderia McLaren says:

        Lol , sure. Sit out the driver who has delivered the most pts, wins, poles for the team since he started there in 2009. Without Vettel, all mark would not have win the titles. Fernando, Jenson, Fernando would have won. Horner knows that. RBR wouldn’t dare.

        Total votes:
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      15. Dragster says:

        @Doug, the pit-stop stuffed up JB too but yeah a good drive by him.

        Total votes:
        0

      16. Max Smoot says:

        What does Dietrich Mateschitz think about this ‘sporting’ blunder?

        Total votes:
        0

      17. Basil says:

        Seb is a little egomaniac without honour!

        Total votes:
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      18. Simon Donald says:

        He kind of flew under the radar a bit, but I was very impressed with Button. Considering where this car was a week ago here he was comfortably ahead of Massa and not a million miles behind Mercedes. If I was the top teams this would really have made me sit up and take notice. It looks like McLaren are starting to get to grips with this car much faster than I thought they would. We obviously need more races to see if this is what is actually happening or if its just a flash in the pan. If it is a true representation of where they are I don’t think it’ll be long until they are fighting for poles and wins.

        Total votes:
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      19. Sebee says:

        Let’s be clear here.

        If anyone Seb or Mark drive the other or crash into the other – any contact for any reason, then I stay silent about being given a race ban. In fact I think FIA will take that step, so RBR won’t even have to.

        Otherwise, any moves on the track within the rules are fair game. One thing is for sure, there won’t be any engines being turned down.

        Total votes:
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      20. Peter says:

        I think you will find that it is the driver that makes this decision, not the team. So it was Seb’s decision to come in on that lap. (hence radio message when they ask him to tell them when it is OK for dry tyres)

        Total votes:
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      21. PB says:

        I’m not so sure..in an instance where the likes of Horner and even Marko not yet finding many kind words to defend their golden boy, I can’t see this happening.
        It’s not often that we see dark sides of people, and this was a stupid, selfish act – not much to praise the petulant kid.

        Total votes:
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    2. Harry says:

      Did Merc under fuel Hamilton or did he just use more than Rosberg? Big difference.

      Total votes:
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      1. James Allen says:

        He used more fighting the Red Bulls. They were marginal from mid way in the race.

        It’s not much we’re talking about only a few kilos

        Total votes:
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      2. Tealeaf says:

        Yeah he used all his fuel in trying to look good but couldn’t even shake off Rosberg who was running lean but had the same pace or even faster, after the fuel was low Hamilton went crying to Ross because he knew Nico was coming through, a complete joke, we can all see Nico is the better driver now but he will lose on the record books, so what I always knew Hamilton was overrated.

        Total votes:
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      3. Andy says:

        So he was under fuelled. To say he used more fighting the Red Bulls is laughable. If you don’t have enough fuel to race fully then think again. If it’s only ‘a few kilos’, then why not put it in the tank. The advantage will be greater than the weight.

        Total votes:
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      4. John says:

        James I think Ross made a moral mistake there telling Nico to stay behind, also Vettel is a true champion.

        Total votes:
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      5. greg says:

        If Lewis used more fuel keeping pace with the redbull’s, then surely that’s his fault and not the teams? If its the teams fault, then surely they should of let rosberg past as they built him a dodgy gearbox for the last race?

        Todays race is proof team orders should be banned.

        Total votes:
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      6. Han says:

        How is ross asking his team to remain in place a moral mistake when vettel ignored the same orders from Rbr and took an underhanded victory when webber turned his engine down make him a true champion?

        Total votes:
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      7. Jake says:

        Tealeaf
        Did you watch the race with no sound?
        Lewis was told to chase the Red Bulls by the team; he was not trying to look good as you say. This was a strategy call from Ross to put some pressure on Red Bull and see what happens.
        Mercedes had nothing to lose from this and everything to gain. They had 3 and 4 and by putting pressure on the Bulls there was every chance a mistake by Vettel or Webber or even tyre or mechanical problems could have netted Mercedes 2 and 3. I do not think Ross thought the Mercedes was faster, and therefore it would have made no sense in a strait race situation to challenge, but rather he was hoping for a weakness. It did not play out but was worth the effort. If Ross had thought Nico could have challenged the Bulls he would have let him go. Would it have been fair to sacrifice Lewis after he did everything the team asked?
        Nico passed lewis on the track but Lewis immediately retook the position. Nico never made it stick. If Nico was really faster as you say he would have been the one chasing the Bulls with Lewis covering his rear. One thing is obvious and that is that Ross is calling the shots and the drivers are there for the team first and their own aspirations second.

        Total votes:
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      8. Bomber says:

        Tealeaf

        You always knew Hamilton was overated?

        You mean you don’t like him.

        Alonso rates him the fastest driver on the grid apart from himself.

        As for Mercedes they were allowed to race until the final pitstop which is normal for teams these days.

        Hamilton was ahead so he stayed ahead.

        Rosberg nice guy and great driver has plenty more races to prove any point he feels he has to prove.

        Total votes:
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    3. John says:

      No, they just wanted to say THANK YOU to Lewis after he stopped at the McLaren box but did not forget that he is actually a Mercedes driver.

      Total votes:
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  9. David Scutt says:

    Having sat across from the red bull pits during the race it was clear that Webber had more pace than Vettel, until the latter decided to take actions into his own hands that is. We learnt a lot about him as a person today. While the pro-vettel crowd cheered him on the podium, the true racing fans knew the truth of how he ‘earned’ it. Hollow victory of you can even call it a victory.

    Total votes:
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    1. Paul Devine says:

      Oh give us a break, I am a webber fan trhough and through, Vettel slaughtered him, hes a race driver. Mark doesnt give in unless he has to. Seb deserved that win. He is after all a race driver.

      What I really want is the full telemetry of all cars on public display. Was Mark really in need of conserving engine. How much fuel did Lewis really have?

      Total votes:
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      1. Carl Craven says:

        I guess Webber having been told in the past not to attack Vettel at later stages of races when he had more pace may have thought he was safe to follow team orders tune down his engine thus disadvantaging him to his team mate in terms of speed and thus allow him to close. The rest is history.

        Next time Webber is told not to attack Vettel, he has every right risking taking them both out of contention.

        I truly believe Vettel’s actions will come back to haunt him. It’s one thing pulling a fast one on your competitor another on your team mate.

        Consider this scenario.

        Final race of the year, Vettel needs a win to take WDC and for Alonso to finish no higher than P3. Alonso qualifies P3 Webber P2 and Vettel P1. Webber gains nothing from winning or even finishing the race as he has no contract for next year.

        Could you trust Webber to be there for you?

        A true competitor and a true winner would be considering ALL of his actions and not short sighted enough to believe that the present might not have any bearing on the future.

        This WILL come back to haunt Vettel and that will demonstrate a lack of holistic vision.

        Total votes:
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      2. MrNed says:

        Yeah, I was thinking something like that. Webber will get an opportunity to get his own back… I’m rather looking forward to it :-)

        Total votes:
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      3. Anne says:

        It´s not about just Seb it´s about the team. Horner gives an order and the driver doesn´t follow it. Vettel should respect authority

        Total votes:
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      4. DonSimón says:

        Exactly. I’ve always been an admirer of Vettel and never really taken Nico too seriously. Racing talent aside Nico got him on the undercut so to speak.

        Total votes:
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      5. M says:

        Was there really any proper order given to Seb?
        All that we heard on the team radio (be careful, it is silly…) just doesn’t sound like an order to me, too ambiguous, not like “maintain the gap” for example. It is more like the things they tell him, when he chases fastest laps at the end of a race. And we all(and the team) know exactly what happens then.

        Total votes:
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      6. Dave P says:

        Hmmmm.. You think Senna ever followed team orders? You think McLaren ordered him to crash into Prost? Yet somehow you no doubt think Senna was the best…..

        Total votes:
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      7. Scuderia McLaren says:

        So should Webber. Silverstone 2011, Brazil 2012.

        Webber set the behaviour, Vettel beat him at his own game.

        Game set and match, as they say.

        Total votes:
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      8. MrNed says:

        Vettel’s actions demonstrate complete lack of respect for the phenomenal team of people who are behind him. It is they – led by Christian Horner – who have provided Vettel with the best car on the grid for the last 3 years. Without this car Vettel would not be a 3x champ. Vettel owes Red Bull and Horner an awful lot more respect than he has shown today.

        Total votes:
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      9. Wade Ferrero says:

        No you don’t have to respect authority Anne, it’s quite weird when people write lines like that like it’s an invariable fact. What right does one group of human beings have to tell another human being not to follow his life passion? It’s corporatism that created this tension, RBR wanted to ensure maximum points for maximum money and take absolutely no risk to prevent that, even though it was at the detriment of competitive sport.

        Racing drivers don’t dream of F1 for the chance follow team orders, they dream of F1 to race for the win. You can’t have a sport that is both a team sport and an individual sport at the same time, those two things are incompatible, and things like this is what happens. Corporatism is at odds with sports, that’s the authority you are demanding respect for. Authority was in the wrong here, and Seb was right not to respect it today.

        Total votes:
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      10. Anne says:

        Wade, I´m afraid anarchy will take you or Vettel or a country to chaos. In school when your teacher tells you to do something you do it. In your work place if your boss tells you to do something you do it.

        Total votes:
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      11. Grant says:

        Paul, Webber was told to turn his engine down. What kind of a fight is that?
        You give us a break.

        Total votes:
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      12. Aey says:

        he is a racing driver but he just can’t do everything he want without listening to the team. he is racing driver, he is WDC, but he is still employee.

        team let them race each other, but every teams don’t like to let them fight each other.

        Total votes:
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      13. ricky says:

        in another era, if ron dennis told senna to hold position behind prost, does anybody here expects senna to obey?

        Total votes:
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      14. Bomber says:

        It’s a sad world where people excuse bad sportsmanship by giving an example of anothers bad sportsmanship.

        Schumacher being the worst example, ramming Hakkinen, hill and trying to with Villeneuve and spinning in qualifying at Monaco!

        Senna and Prost is a bad example they hated each other.

        I bet Senna would not have done what Vettel did to Gerhard Berger in only the 2nd race of the season.

        Total votes:
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      15. Arun says:

        @Ricky: Senna probably wouldn’t have. But I think Senna would have gone on the radio to say “Tell Prost that I’m still racing”.. Not the way Vettel did.

        Total votes:
        0

      16. Yak says:

        It’s not about if there was a “need” to conserve the engine. They had a clear 1-2 in the bag. If the team tell both drivers to back off to be safe with the tyres/fuel and to save the engine and gearbox and whatnot, the driver should listen.

        The driver might wish to disagree, but at the end of the day, it’s the guys on the wall and in the factory who have all the data, and have to worry about making their equipment last until the end of the season. Why would you want to stress the cars when you could have a clear 1-2 by just cruising?

        Total votes:
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    2. Sebee says:

      What’s next? Participation WDC trophies?

      Do you win WDCs by letting your #2 win races?

      Total votes:
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      1. Craig D says:

        But it wouldn’t have done them any good if they’d collided like in Turkey. If they thought they were racing then great, but that wasn’t the case.

        I would rather see them race to the end but disobeying your bosses is disrespectful and could come back to haunt you.

        As a viewer I’m glad the action happened but it wasn’t sporting, even though it is ironic to expect racing drivers not to race!

        Total votes:
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      2. ddt88 says:

        Who said Webber was number 2?

        Total votes:
        0

      3. Kay says:

        Good point.

        Total votes:
        0

      4. Sebee says:

        Mark did. When he won a GP and said, “Not bad for a #2”.

        He knows the score.

        Total votes:
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      5. Kay says:

        Might as well make it a one-driver team across the grid if #2s aren’t allowed to win.

        Total votes:
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      6. David says:

        Simple fix.. ONE CAR TEAMS!

        You wont have a problem, because there will be no number two or three to worry about. (Heard a rumor Ferrari wants three car teams!)

        Total votes:
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      7. Chooky says:

        RBR have been very clear in stating that they value both Mark & Vettel equally. Don’t you remember this?

        Webber is NOT a number 2 driver.
        Unfortunately he is paired with Vettel (who the press [& Marco] love but in spite of a large following, many diehard F1 fans do not like him).

        There was a team order in place – yes TO’s have been controversial BUT they’re legal.

        Fact is Vettel did not drive for his team at Malaysia.
        He put both RBR cars at risk of DNF (in closing laps) to satisfy his own arrogance.

        F1 is a team sport.

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      8. Syd says:

        “Fact is Vettel did not drive for his team at Malaysia.
        He put both RBR cars at risk of DNF (in closing laps) to satisfy his own arrogance.”

        Spot on!

        Total votes:
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      9. Kit says:

        Agreed, Chooky.

        Some may have forgotten what happened in Turkey a couple of years ago when the two raced each other.
        From Horner’s point of view, that’s 43 points being risked by someone who decided not to listen to you, who thinks you are no longer in control of the team..

        Total votes:
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      10. Wayne says:

        Yes, if you let them win them all 😉

        Total votes:
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      11. PB says:

        To be fair on Red Bull , they did ‘almost’ everything fairly – except telling off Vettel and either ordering him to increase gap or after passing let Webber retake the lead. For crying out loud, they haven’t even defended Vettel yet!! Everyone including Rocky, Horner and Marko, and even Newey on the podium appeared embarrassed.
        For those claiming Vettel was faster and duly won the race, I think it’s just a way of saving some of Vettel’s dignity after this episode (if that’s possible) as whether Webber turned down his engine to save the car or because he HAD to, we’ll never really know. Going by what Red Bull have consistently and publicly maintained he did because he was asked to do so by the team, not because he had to. This looks even more likely as it’ll be very easy for the team to say he had a problem, etc. and save face and protect the favoured one.
        Some people in this forum just don’t seem to understand how much is too much and where to draw the line.

        Total votes:
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      12. PB says:

        Also for Webber doubters, Webber demonstrated today that he has matured after the last couple of years but Vettel hasn’t. Webber could have easily run wide on Turn 4 (or is it 5 where Vettel overtook finally) – either forcing Vettel out of the track or crashing into him taking them both out. But he didn’t!

        Total votes:
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    3. Harry says:

      The race gave me a chance to explain to my 8 year old son about character of a real man. I’m certain Mark did as instructed, its a crappy way for Vettel to win though. We have a pair of Seb’s gloves hanging in my son’s room…wonder how long they’ll stay there now.

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      1. Basil says:

        +1

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    4. Mitchel says:

      +2010

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    5. John says:

      Webber had more pace? That is the most funny thing I heard all day lol whats next? Hamilton also had more pace than Rosberg?

      Total votes:
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    6. Chris says:

      Whatever, I suppose Alonso is an angel in your eyes, with crash gate and costing Mclaren 100 million dollars – real honour there – saint even!! Hell he even expects team mates to roll out of the way, at least Vettel passed his!

      Win at all costs is the name of the game, a TRIPLE world champion understands this!!

      Total votes:
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    7. Bo Amato says:

      A certain Giles Villeneuve was killed in qualifying because of Didier Pironi’s similar antics in the Grand Prix before.

      Like to see Mark in competitive machinery for one year after he leaves red bull and he can put his mate seb in the wall.

      Vettel is a very good driver, but the team has treated Webber as a second class citizen since the arrival of the golden boy, much of it documented for you and I, do obviously it goes so much deeper!

      With the crooks involved in F1 I would not be surprised of so many bad starts by webber down to team fiddles with engine mapping, clutch and gear box tampering. etc. I I hope not! Best thing to happen for Webber and us fans is an immediate switch of MASSA for WEBBER. That would make the rest of 2013 outstanding!

      Total votes:
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  10. Jock Ulah says:

    Not Sebastian Pedal-to-the-Vetal’s fault –

    Obviously they’re force-feeding him that caffeine concoction of theirs prior to the race to keep him sharp. Webber pours his prescription in the petrol tank when they’re not looking.

    At least it’s not as bad as the stuff the studios fed to child actors in Hollywood in the old days.

    Total votes:
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  11. Rockie says:

    This was Mark Webber behind Vettel in Silverstone 2011

    “I am not fine with it. No. That’s the answer to that,” the Australian said when asked if he understood the team’s decision.
    “If Fernando retires on the last lap we are battling for the victory so I was fine until the end. Of course I ignored the team as I want to try and get another place. Seb was doing his best and I was doing my best.
    “I don’t want to crash with anyone, but that was it. I tried to do my best with the amount of conversation I had. One-way conversation obviously as I wasn’t talking too much back.
    “There was a lot of traffic coming to me, but I was still trying to do my best to pass the guy in front.”

    But today the only difference Vettel got true and its funny he says he turned his engine down that didnt look like that when he was defending his place also his Schumacheresque defence on the pit straight.
    Oh well on to China.

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    1. Rach says:

      Yeah I agree. I think it is the support of the underdog. Everyone clearly thinks that Vettel is favoured so whatever Webber does is fair game. Obviously what Seb did today was out of line but as you point out how does it differ from Silverstone 2011? Or how about at Brazil last year when Webber was extremely harsh on Seb.

      The funny thing though is that when Schumacher did that chop on Barrichello everyone went crazy yet Webber’s move has been completely ignored because he had been wronged.

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      1. Dave the Expat says:

        Take off the blinkers. Webber didn’t move towards the pit wall. he held his line on the right side of the track, and Vettel chose to dive under Webber.
        Look at the footage

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      2. Rach says:

        Your telling me to take my blinkers off!! If your telling me webber held his line and didn’t squeeze Vettel into the pit wall then there is only one person with blinkers on!

        I don’t criticise webber for this as far as I’m concerned its racing. However what frustrates me is the double standards when analysing situations.

        Total votes:
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    2. Wayne says:

      Ahhh, but that WAS NOT the only difference was it? Not by a long way. People always try and present things to match their opinion.

      Why was it very different? Because in that race, unlike this one, there was no agreement between the drivers before the race. The team decided to pull that one on WEB with no warning. This time both drivers have admitted that they was an agreement between them BEFORE the race started. They knew what the situation was going into the race and both signed up for it.

      Total votes:
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      1. Mike J says:

        Great point, but please don’t let the facts get in the way of a good story !

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    3. Sebastian says:

      Very true. In fact Webber comes off as quite the hypocrite… his comments after Silverstone was:

      “To manage it but then be told to hold position is something I wasn’t prepared to follow at the time. If I’d backed off and held the gap at three seconds, as I was asked to do, it would have been much more difficult for me to sleep after the race.
      http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/93065/

      Webber whines which ever way the wind blows… if he had any character he would have said that it was fine because he would have done the same given the opportunity.

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    4. **Paul** says:

      Lol great post and quote. Mark can’t have it both ways, he set a precedent that day. I also think the engine stuff is rubbish or Seb would have sailed past with DRS as well. Mark defended hard, so hard he almost put Vettel in the wall. Good hard racing.

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    5. alexbookoo says:

      Wow. That’s a killer quote to pull out.

      But at least Webber didn’t say “I did get the message, but no action followed because I misunderstood.” Or “When I took off my helmet and saw that Mark didn’t look too happy I talked to him and he came straight to the point. That was when it struck me like lightning.”

      Or my personal favourite, the excuse he used on the podium, before he’d had time to think of something better: “It was very hot.”

      He should have been honest about it like Webber.

      It would be difficult to contrive a finishing order like today’s where nearly everyone is unhappy. You have to go down to Grojean in 6th and Hulkenburg in 8th to find anyone even moderately satisfied with their race.

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    6. Scuderia McLaren says:

      Agree 100%

      Webber set the tone of RBR’s team orders disputes, not Vettel. Also Brazil 2012 don’t forget.

      Total votes:
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    7. Trent says:

      Webber battled Vettel for a while at Silverstone, the call came, and he backed off.

      You can’t defend Seb’s actions today. Even he’s not trying to.

      Total votes:
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    8. ed24f1 says:

      Bingo RE: Silverstone 2011, and people were praising Webber for that!

      I think that if this was in reverse, Webber would be treated with far less criticism than Vettel has been.

      Total votes:
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    9. marcus2 says:

      Yes but had Vettel turned his engine down?

      Total votes:
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      1. Rockie says:

        What is this with turned engine down BS did Mark look like he was driving with less power even with DRS Vettel couldnt get the job done.

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  12. Denise says:

    I’m a fan of Vettel but the whole “I made a mistake” thing just doesn’t wash with me. Unless there is more to the story that hasn’t come out yet, it seems pretty disingenuous to say the absolute least. That being said though, I’m fairly certain that if it was Webber in Vettels position everyone would be cheering him for continuing to race, regardless of the orders.
    Silverstone 2011, anyone?
    What CH does about it now will be interesting, first time I can actually remember him or Newey showing (albeit not a lot) displeasure publically towards Vettel.

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    1. Sebee says:

      What else could he say? He made a cold ruthless move – just how everyone likes it when Lewis would. Then he had to sugar coat it for the media.

      Total votes:
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    2. [MISTER] says:

      And people still wonder why Vettel is disliked so much. Hw was already throwing his toys out of the pram early in the race..
      I sense desperation from Vettel’s side already. Seeing he’s not got a car which is 1s faster than the oposition, he’s pretty desperate.

      Vettel and RBR will never be liked as much as Ferrari, Williams and McLaren. Never!

      Total votes:
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      1. danny11 says:

        Of course not! They are energy drink Company and not legendary F1 team like the one you have mentioned and they will never be. They should know that Newey will not live forever and from next season they will face a great challenge as costumer car with new engines coming in. Ferrari should definitely have an edge!

        Total votes:
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      2. Scuderia McLaren says:

        Given the resources, special FOM deals and FIA rule vetos Ferrari have enjoyed for some time, having had “the edge” does not translate to success does it.

        Last 2 WDC – 2007 Kimi, 2004 Michael.
        2 drivers titles in a decade of having the edge ain’t great is it.

        Total votes:
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      3. Chooky says:

        Agreed about the older, prestigious teams with long F1 histories, without question.

        An energy drink company yes. It cannot be overlooked however, that this energy drink co have won three consecutive DOUBLE WC’s.

        Pretty good going for a drink co don’t you think?

        Total votes:
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      4. Sugar Water says:

        +1

        Total votes:
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      5. John says:

        Vettel is disliked because mainly the english speaking fans are jealous of his talent and success, mainly the Hamilton brigade, its probably because you know as long as Seb is motivated, healthy and in F1 I doubt Hamilton will ever win the title again, mind you even Rosberg is quicker than Hamilton, shame he won’t be able to show it again.

        Total votes:
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      6. PB says:

        +1
        Certainly not, judging by the way they’re going.

        Total votes:
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      7. gudien says:

        You are assuming I like Ferrari. Ferrari are the most guilty of orchestrating ‘team orders’ for their benefit. Have you never heard of Schumacher vs. Irvine, Schumacher vs. Barrichello, Alonso vs. Massa?

        When it comes to sport Ferrari are bush league.

        Total votes:
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      8. Poyta says:

        +1!!!!

        Total votes:
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    3. Denise says:

      I’ve just watched the race again and I’ve come to the conclusion that Vettel had lost his temper when he couldn’t get past Mark, and then when he got out of the car was like “sh*t! What have i just done?!?” Right or wrong, you can almost understand it.

      Total votes:
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    4. chrisnz says:

      Agreed. It’s a lot easier to apologise once you are sitting in the middle seat of the press conference and with a healthy early lead in the championship.

      Total votes:
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    5. Grant H says:

      Agree what a joke, seb knew exactly what’s was asked and ignored

      Total votes:
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    6. David says:

      Vettel may hold three WDC but his actions were made even more untenable by the multiple attempts to lie his way out of it.

      He arrived at Parc Fermi to a subdued team and like a naughty boy he knew right then he had better come up with a story.

      Story #1 – I didn’t hear the call

      Like a child when your first excuse doesn’t get traction you makeup another one.

      Story #2 – I didn’t understand the call

      This went over even less so again Vettel’s inner child realising the jig was up

      Story # 3 – I did a bad thing but it’s too late to undo it. Wish I could.

      This shows how shallow and lacking in vision this boy is. He will be forever know as a world championship liar and not for the records he so desperately seeks.

      Final thought looking at the above, maybe Helmut Marko is helping too much the above defence I have heard in numerous court proceedings. 😉

      Total votes:
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  13. Brian says:

    Red Bull should sideline Sebastian Vettle for China. Sends a message that no one is bigger than the team. His actions could have cost them 43 points. It also sends Mark Webber a good signal and with 19 races to go that’s going to be important.

    Give the one race seat to Daniel Ricciardo. That helps Red Bull test him in a decent car.. and as he’s an Aussie the irony wouldn’t be lost on Mark.

    Total votes:
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    1. +1 !!!!!

      Total votes:
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      1. Sebastian says:

        Yeah, give the ride to Yuji Ide!!!

        Total votes:
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    2. brendan says:

      well said i was thinking the same,vettel 3 times champion,webber may never be champion.(i wish he would do it this year).
      vettel has no respect for webber or the team.
      if i was webber i would of took vettel out,clipped his back wheel.
      webber last win was last year british gp,vettel
      knows webber only got a few seasons left,his took his chance of victory away, over the sake of 7 points, when there is 425 left to fight for.
      webber has helped vettel on more than a few occasions.
      maybe f1 should go down the motogp route and seperate the garages,have every man for himself.

      Total votes:
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      1. Ahmed says:

        Webber would never help Vettel willingly!

        He tried to race Vettel in Brazil last year when the championship was on the line, when team obviously told him not to.

        Webber ignored team orders in British GP 2011, when Vettel was in front. He tried to overtake and Vettel raced him, the only difference was Vettel got the job done, whilst Webber does what he’s good at, whinge and whine!

        Vettel was frustrated in the race, Webber got the undercut, and Vettel was being held up and this screwed up Vettels strategy as he in turn lost a place to Hamilton, and almost to Rosberg. He obviously wanted to prove that he was quicker, did it on track, no conspiracy theories!

        Thanks Seb for giving us real racing, not controlled rubbish like Ferrari or Mercedes.

        Total votes:
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      2. Yak says:

        Webber in Brazil raced hard to begin with, when Vettel was basically looked like he’d walk the WDC in. Later in the race when Vettel needed to make his way back through the field, Webber clearly let him just go straight through. The situations were different and Webber acted accordingly.

        Total votes:
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      3. John says:

        Youve got it wrong webber was not holding vettel up as team told him to look after tyres something vettel didnt seem to understand,you heard webber in post race interview saying there not racing at full pace due to tyre strategy

        Total votes:
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    3. AlexD says:

      Never said it towards anybody, but I hate Vettel after what he did. I hope he wins everything in his life that is there to be won, but spends his life lonely…win no firneds and nobody to really like him or care about him……

      Total votes:
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    4. Wilma the Great says:

      Well, I think, it would be a bit harsh to sideline Mark in China for almost sending Seb into the pit wall, he just didn’t want to give in on his position – that’s natural.

      But you’re right, it could have cost the team 43 points, so it would be a legitimate action.

      Total votes:
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    5. Simon Donald says:

      I agree completely but it will never happen!!

      Total votes:
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    6. Awesome Idea..

      But Christian Horner doesnt have the balls to do it.

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  14. Sebee says:

    To: Mark
    From: Sebastian

    Hey Mark,

    Sorry mate.  It was an accident.  Anyhow, you need to understand I am going for 4 in a row, please see the biggee picture, Schumi’s records aren’t going to fall by playing nice.  Holding position would have cheates the fans out of a show as well.

    Cheers,
    Sebastian.

    P.S.  You think I will be DOTD?

    Total votes:
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    1. Sebastian says:

      Or maybe…

      Hey Mark,

      Learning from the man… Silverstone 2011.

      Yours sincerly,
      Sebastian

      Total votes:
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    2. Toothless says:

      To: Sebastian
      From: Mark

      Hey Seb,

      No worries Mate! I understand how much you like breaking records. Clearly the numbers today were worth more to you than anything else.

      Regards,
      Mark

      P.S.

      If DOTD means d*ck of the day, absolutely.

      Total votes:
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    3. Wilma the Great says:

      To: Seb
      From: Mark

      I, too want to break Schumis records. Today, I began by defending position like him. How was my driving? Call 1-800-NO-OVERTAKING-ME-WO-TEAM-PERMISSION

      Total votes:
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    4. rafa says:

      The team told both to turn engines down: one complied, the other didn´t and then ate away a 4 s lead… so that´s not an accident. I wrote earlier -in a comment waiting endless moderation- that i had nothing against what Seb did, but then realized the whole point: they where well in the lead, and where told to conserve engines for the future as the team had already attained a 1/2 finish. They could have “let them race” as many say here, but it comes at the expense of a future engine failure or racing incident, so the call was in order. So sorry, the super exciting race from Vettel you saw was in fact him overtaking a lame duck with les revs in the motor. He´s taken his chances, and I have nothing against it but:

      -Apologizing with that kinda didn´t mean it attitude is completely fake: you´re ambitious and ruthless, so don´t apologize for it, hold your hand up and show your true face; you asked a few weeks ago why there was so much dislike towards Vettel, that´s why: he likes playing the nice kid role who´s never broken a dish, and that really is not him.

      -I would like to see what you have to say now about team orders. RBR clearly give them and Seb has been benefiting from them more often than not. perhaps, your well known position on “poor Massa” should be reviewed hereafter.

      Total votes:
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      1. rafa says:

        Oh, and about DOTD I don´t think he will get it.

        Total votes:
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      2. Sebee says:

        I will tell you what it is rafa. I understand team orders. I know they make sense. I know they are needed.

        But every once in a while, I really really like it when they are not followed. Webber has done it. And Vettel has done it. I wish Massa would do it once or twice.

        Total votes:
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      3. Sebee says:

        Oh yeah. Mark is allowed to race Seb to a much highet degree than Massa was until just recently. That is what bug me. Sure, we know neither Mark or Massa will likely be backed for a WDC effort by their teams. But at least Mark is allowed to win by his team.

        Total votes:
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    5. Msta says:

      Yes Seb, you definitely are D$@!head Of The Day.

      Total votes:
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  15. Ben says:

    I can see this being the beginning of the end of Red Bull and Vettel’s relationship – although I do not necessarily mean to imply it will happen imminently. The way the team reacted, especially Newey but also, surprisingly, even Marko, suggests that Vettel’s actions today demonstrate he is now becoming bigger than the team.

    It’s inevitable – after three consecutive World Championships and a truck load of records – there is a tug of war as to who is responsible for most of the success, Vettel or the team.

    Vettel can point to the fact that since he turned up in the team they became the front runners, although Red Bull can point to the massive regulation change.

    However, the twist in the tale was how quickly Vettel apologised after the event. While an apology of sorts was inevitable the fact it came so quickly is probably a result of Vettel sensing the damage he had done to his relationship with the team and the acknowledgement that it is thanks to Red Bull he has been able to have such a massive success (that’s not to say without Red Bull he would have had none) – this could certainly salvage the relationship for a couple more seasons however whereas before this race it seemed that neither Red Bull or Vettel would want to part company for any reason other than fulfilling the supposed holy grail of being a Ferrari champion things have changed and there is now a clear ticking countdown clock on Vettel’s duration at Milton Keynes.

    The only question is how much time is on that clock.

    Total votes:
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    1. Dave C says:

      Vettel join Ferrari and show the world what you’re made of, Redbull are taking credits when its not deserved, as soon as he leaves you will see the team fade.

      Total votes:
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      1. Gate 21 says:

        You must be deluded if you think Ferrari will take Vettel now. Ferrari drivers follow team orders. Seb just flushed his chance at wearing red.

        Total votes:
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      2. Nige says:

        What? Do you know who Adrian Newey is?

        Total votes:
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      3. Anne says:

        Because Neweys has nothing to do with the car, hasn´t he?

        Total votes:
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      4. Wayne says:

        That’s a joke right? VET is the star and the Newey-RBR partnership are taking all the credit from him? That’s the funniest thing I’ve heard all weekend and don’t forget I have already listened to VET try and explain his lack of morals away which in itself was hysterical.

        Total votes:
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      5. Hal says:

        Wayne, check his other posts they are equally funny (i.e. delusional).

        Total votes:
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      6. Bomber says:

        Wayne

        Spot on!

        Total votes:
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      7. D@X says:

        Car Driver combo is a good one but I still feel Adrian is the main reason the team is able to adapt and change but still maintain a fast car. Well on the way to the top you are bound to break a few promises..Mark is in the firing line, all he needs is play the team game and beat the guy on the track, i do agree its a dirty trick especially if you agree to maintain position. The team gets paid on Constructors points and not driver credits, with the economy, you have to ensure you take all thats on the table and worry about the rest later.
        I remember Lewis asking his team in Turkey ” If I slow down, he’s not going to pass me, the team said yes, Button sensed an overtaking opportunity and went for it, but was beaten fair and square and took a seat behind Lewis. I dont think they ever got on after that. But it made button look like a mug. Webber and Vettle had just crashed. But today Lewis was told to slow down, Nico tried it and overtook Lewis but before you know it he was over taken again, Nico had to be reminded to take a seat. Its a Team game and if the boss decides no change because you can’t catch the from runners or there is no threat from the moving chicanes from the back then no point going home empty handed…constructors equals money and thats what they race for as a team.

        For those that can deal with the tension of team orders please switch to GP2, hot headed youngsters. Thrilling overtakes and some moves that are so mind boggling…as in what where you thinking.

        Total votes:
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      8. Gazz says:

        Oh my goodness, you should have been a politician. Lots of words which mean nothing to those who us who can see beyond our rose tinted glasses. I agree that JB got put in his place,, but only after LH retook him. Jenson save fuel, this is critical. Nico was by far the better driver today and any stupid meaningless apology or “humble” comment from Lewser will never fool those who see the truth. It would have made no difference to “team points” today if Mercedes had let the quicker driver through (Nico) to take what would have been a well deserved podium. Lewis was beaten today hands down and this will send him a couple of very strong messages. 1. Nico is faster than you 2. You wont be able to hide behind team orders forever 3. Glad you feel the need to emulate Jenson lol

        Total votes:
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      9. Doug says:

        That comment reminds me of a song….

        …oh yes…

        Daydream Believer! :-)

        Total votes:
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      10. absolude says:

        Alonso vetoed Vettel’s move to Ferrari.
        Unlike Vettel when Hamilton wanted to join RedBull.
        Big difference.

        Total votes:
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    2. Sebee says:

      Yes, as a team boss I would fire a 3X WDC for winning.

      What is going on here today? Seriously!

      Total votes:
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      1. Multi 21 says:

        That’s why you aren’t a team boss.

        Total votes:
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      2. Arun says:

        You got yourself a nice name there… Ha ha… 😀

        Total votes:
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      3. Ben says:

        I did not say he would get fired. I was commenting on how this was the moment the Vettel / Red Bull relationship soured and they will grow apart from here on. Much like Lewis Hamilton started to grow apart from McLaren, a team everyone believed he would be at forever prior to LieGate.

        Total votes:
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    3. Quade says:

      Marko says he wouldn’t try to stop Vettel if he wants to leave. That was quite surprising, considering that Vettel is widely seen as Red Bulls golden goose.
      Vettels action today was swollen headed, but it would seem that Vettel has been testing the teams patience, it only came out in public today.

      Total votes:
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    4. hero_was_senna says:

      That thought crossed my mind today.
      In recent weeks, we have had Dieter say he wouldn’t stop Vettel leaving even with a contract in place.
      He understood exactly what the team had told him, yet believed that the team would support him like they did in Turkey 2010.
      It was obvious from Horner, Newey and Webber that that wasn’t the case. He proved he has no respect for any of them.
      Most interesting was Dr Marko’s garbled comments which didn’t back Vettel up at all.

      Who knows, maybe Vettel in 2014 is go after all.

      Total votes:
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  16. Matt says:

    There’s no way in a racing sense for Webber to get satisfaction – a gifted win won’t do it; so I suspect Seb might be washing Mark’s Porsche for the next few weeks.

    China will be -very- interesting.

    Total votes:
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    1. gudien says:

      Mark has a Porsche? Good for him. I like him better already.

      Total votes:
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      1. Jack Flash (Aust) says:

        Yes. A GT3.

        Total votes:
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    2. Scuderia McLaren says:

      Nah, won’t be any dramas in China. Webber has used 1 of his 2 great races per season he tends to have. He’ll be back mid pack again till maybe British GP.

      Total votes:
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  17. Gareth says:

    Interesting argument here but i wonder what would have happened if Webber overtook Vettel and did not listen to orders?
    Red Bull is clearly established as Vettels team, with Webber playing a reluctant number 2. The big difference is how Webber has responded. Coulthard, Barrichello and Irvine all kept their mouths shut, playing the PR game. Webber has not and it reaffirms my belief that he will leave the team this year. As for Vettel he has proved that he is in it for himself. If this was football and he was told to come off and refused he would probably be suspended. I will be watching developments on this very very closely.
    In regards to Hamilton and Roseberg, look at the expression on Rosbergs face in the picture above, he looks dejected and pretty furious, will he too have to play second fiddle to Hamilton? Mclaren have shown once again that they could not set up a toilet let alone a car and their pit stops mistakes from 2012 continue to happen in 2013 ( although all the teams seemed to be in meltdown). Alonso must have had brain fade or is Massa starting to pressure the Spaniard?

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    1. Sebee says:

      What would happen is no new contract for following year. As he is on year to year.

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      1. Elie says:

        Lol yes

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      2. Gareth says:

        Never thought of that, what I can see is Ricardo being called up

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    2. Rossco says:

      Where will Webber go? You seem to forget that whilst Vettel clearly did the wrong thing yesterday, he has had the pace of Webber for years now… both in qualifying and the raw pace during the race. Webber mostly messes up every start, this was the unusual case where he didn’t… He needs the car to be perfect for everything to go right.

      Where is Webber going to go? He has said that he would leave F1 if he couldn’t go to a competitive car and team… Doesn’t leave many options open as clearly Red Bull have been the fastest for some time.

      As far as Hamilton and Rosberg goes? He’s outqualified Rosberg in both races, finished above him in Melbourne (even though Rosberg retired but didnt have the pace)… Hamilton and Alonso the fastest drivers in F1, if I was team boss, I’d want a return on my 30 million pound investment that’s for sure.

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      1. Gareth says:

        Yes but as Brawn said “there is no number 1 at Mercedes”, Rosberg may think after Brawns history with Irvine and Barrichello if this is the case.
        As for Webber, take my money head of home, or wait until a vacant seat comes up at Lotus or Ferrari.

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  18. AuraF1 says:

    Bizarre – team orders that normally rob the fans of wheel to wheel action ironically engineered the best wheel to wheel fight for years! Of course it does mean having a driver disobey.

    The sad thing is when they do obey like Rosberg we lose another brutal fight.

    Sad for Jenson too – getting that poor car into solid points only for the wheel nut gremlins to return. Metaphor of the wheels coming off his race can be used again.

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    1. Sebee says:

      People hate to admit it, but Vettel played it right. Only Mark looses out. On a scale 4th WDC in a riw and fan entertainment are more important that a win for Mark.

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      1. Multi 21 says:

        “People hate to admit it, but Vettel played it right.” Sure. That is why no one in the team is defending him. Even Horner has given him a whack in the media. Seb has even had to grovel a half-baked public apology to MW.

        You know what happens when drivers throw sportsmanship out the window by ignoring team orders in search of personal glory with no regards to the collective effort of the team? They become Didier Pironi.

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  19. Schumilewis says:

    Hi James, Do you think Mark should be a bit more “robust” in the future if Vettel tries to overtake him? I think if it were the other way round Seb would have no hesitation in running Mark off the track, this will lay a marker down to Seb.
    Also do you think Horner needs to be clearer with team orders to Seb ( I don’t think I heard him tell Seb not to overtake )? I think Ross Brawn made his orders clear and handled the situation brilliantly. Nico proved he is a clever and mature driver and I think Lewis will obey orders if the tables are turned.

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    1. Dave C says:

      You think Hamilton will obey if it’s the other way round? I doubt that, and that Hamilton fans wouldn’t be happy about it, amazing how they are all silent about the situation, Nico is the faster driver yet in 2 races he’s been treated awfully bad, funny how he lost a gearbox, funny how he’s always faster yet get stunned in the final parts of Q3, Vettel please join Ferrari and show what Redbull is missing, also Nico join Redbull and leave this farce of a setup at Mercedes.

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      1. Harry says:

        If Hamilton is Merc’s contractual No.1 (Martin Brundle speculated he was), then Rosberg has to deal with it or leave.

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      2. Anne says:

        I´m not so sure. Lewis was dead honest about the situation during the podium interview.

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      3. Cliff says:

        Agree, If Lewis Hamilton felt that Nico should have been on the podium, letting him pass would not have been difficult, especially as there was no danger from behind. Having listened to Vettel say “Mark should have won today”, I’m left thinking why, if you felt that way, did you ignore team orders, or better still, just give the place back? In both cases I would suggest that the points were the priority. As for the fall-out, we can deal with that after the race!

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      4. John says:

        Yeah so honest and heart warming, he felt Rosberg was robbed, he thought Rosberg was the one that should have stood on that podium…..
        Ok so if he believed all that why didn’t he just let Rosberg through?

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      5. Matt says:

        But he was still standing there. He could _easily_ have moved over to let Nico pass. What he was struggling with was the first taste of the bitter sweet taste of ‘victory’ that resulted from the off-season deal that’s clearly been done rather that out-racing Nico.

        Team orders rankle everyone because we think (naturally) that it’s about maximizing speed and balancing that against tyre wear/fuel use for 100% of the race; actually it’s about 80% of the race, at which point team orders come into play, and we hold station. What sucks is the team doesn’t communicate when that cutoff point will be to the public prior to the race.
        Nico clearly would have finished 20s ahead of Lewis in a 100% race, and Lewis knew it. His turkey was well cooked (that last time through turn 1-2 was shopping centre pace): his victory over his team mate completely arbitrary.
        It’s hard to say if Webber could have raced Seb to the end given they were conserving tyres; obviously neither of them pushed their tyres to 100% of race distance: if they had, perhaps Matk’s harder tyres would have seen him back past Seb’s older, softer set in the last laps: but Mark, and eventually Seb both backed off, so again, an arbitrary race length.

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      6. Schumilewis says:

        I’m sorry to say, but your idea that somehow Mercedes fix qualifying and races is absurd and lacks any real knowledge of F1! How could they slow either driver whilst both are on qualifying laps simultaneously?
        I am a Hamilton fan but I have always thought he would find Rosberg a tough nut to crack. I think Hamilton would obey team orders if the situation was the same as today.
        As for Vettel against Alonso, this is something all real F1 fans want to see and then we’ll see if Vettel is as good as his career to date would suggest.

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      7. Yup I hear what your saying… Mercedes *definitely* gave Rosberg a faulty gearbox so he wouldn’t trouble Hamilton in the first race of the season… give me a break!

        Not to mention that in Aus, Hamilton was pulling *away* from Rosberg.

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      8. John says:

        Pulling away at melbourne? Well the 3 laps leading up to Rosberg retiring he was over 6sec behind Hamilton, and when he retired he was only 4sec behind, you do the maths was Hamilton pulling away? And IQ test is in order, Nico has been faster, now he’s not allowed to race, it’ll only hurt Mercedes.

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      9. Paige says:

        Dave,

        Hamilton has beat Rosberg in two qualifying sessions and two races. Hamilton was in a position to win today before he was instructed by his team after overtaking Vettel on pit stops that he had to save fuel. That’s the only thing that allowed Rosberg to get close to Hamilton. It had nothing to do with the skills of the drivers.

        Rosberg did do a nice job today, though.

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      10. Quade says:

        I saw the mercedes mechanic taking a wacking ‘ammer to Rosbergs gear box and heard Ross Brawn ordering him to go slower in Q3 (Oz and Sepang). Merc techies also put rats in his electrics (to fry em up real good) at Melbourne.

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      11. Nigel says:

        It seems pretty clear that he would, from his interview today:

        “Nico deserved to be where I am. With the position in the championship the team thought it was logical to stay in position, but Nico drove a smarter and more controlled race than me today.

        “Would I let him past in the future? I probably would.”

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      12. Helenka says:

        Yes of course Mercedes are going to wreck rosbergs gearbox……. Why would try do that? At the end of the day the teams first priority is the constructors championship where the money comes from. but they wouldn’t do too good if the second car kept on not finishing because the team sabotaged it, particularly when you up against the other teams with two cars regularly in the top couple of placings. The second priority is the drivers championship, which is why Braun decided to take the good points away from today as they weren’t going to challenge the redbull a, rather than risk both cars crashing out due to drivers pushing for the sake of their egos

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    2. Lol says:

      More robust? He practically pushed Vettel against the wall like Schumi did to Rubi.

      He should just take it like he expected Vettel to take it SIlverstone 2011.

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    3. Spinodontosaurus says:

      I don’t think either Webber or Vettel could have been any more robust without resorting to Touring Car ‘racing’.

      When Vettel eventually got past, it was because Webber was parking on the apex of T4 to stop Vettel cutting back on him, which Vettel read and acted accordingly.

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    4. Yak says:

      We don’t necessarily hear all the radio transmissions. Horner might very well have stated it very clearly to Vettel earlier, but we didn’t get to hear it. From what I gather, they’d also discussed beforehand what would happen in the event of them leading an easy 1-2 to the end.

      We heard more from Rosberg/Brawn, but it doesn’t necessarily mean we heard everything that went on between them either.

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    5. Jake says:

      It is not so much a team order as a standing agreement. CH does not have to tell Seb, Seb knows the arrangement and deliberately broke it.
      It was not so much that Lewis could have let Nico past more that Lewis could not have resisted if Nico had decided to ignore the team order. Lewis is a racing driver it was clear from his demeanour on the podium that he did not think he should have been there on merit.

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  20. Jacob says:

    James is there any merit to the rumours of Mark looking for a 2014 drive with Lotus?

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    1. MJSib says:

      Would this be a straight swap with Kimi going to Red Bull? Then let’s see what Vettel is made of going against Kimi!

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      1. Grant says:

        Yea… Let Kimi go to Redbull, and put Vettel in his place.

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  21. McLaren78 says:

    “…with some saying that this is the kind of determination you need to be a multiple World Champion and be ranked amongst the greats.” Seriously? Your team-mate turns the engine down as told by the team, runs on a harder tyre compound, is reassured by team they’ll both hold positions, and then you ignore all, pass him, and that’s a trait of a ‘great’? No, that’s a trait of someone who has the team wrapped around him and knows he can get away with anything.

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    1. Sebee says:

      Would you rather they radio a message for Mark to move over? That was an option. Would you like it more as an F1 fan?

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      1. Bomber says:

        seebee

        I am a sportsfan as well as an F1 fan and what Vettel did stinks.#

        It may have been exciting when watching it but when you find out the true facts afterwards it leaves a very sour taste in the mouth as you realise Webber was jumped/mugged by Vettel.

        He has demeaned himself.

        He had 10 laps or so to think about what he had done and did nothing to put it right.

        He only apologises when he realises how angry the team are.

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    2. Aaron Noronha says:

      Hey buddy dont even for a second believe he turned his engine down. Mark could see the move coming in his mirrors and he even tried to block by running vettel against the pit wall(a move for which Micheal Schmacher was given a penalty against Rubens). IF his engine was really turned down Vettel would have completed the move down the straight before the corner. If Vettels engine was indeed running higher revs to Marks’ with the aid of DIR, Vettel would have been more than a cars length in front before braking for the corner. In fact it took Vettel 3 or 4 more corners to complete the overtake. That without a doubt proves that Vettel was pushing Webber right from the pitstop to the conclusion of that move. It takes a fraction of a second to turn the engine back up and by the way Mark was defending his line and having his eyes in the mirror on the straight i can bet that the engine was running to the max.

      Btw did you read the above comment
      This was Mark Webber behind Vettel in Silverstone 2011

      “I am not fine with it. No. That’s the answer to that,” the Australian said when asked if he understood the team’s decision.
      “If Fernando retires on the last lap we are battling for the victory so I was fine until the end. Of course I ignored the team as I want to try and get another place. Seb was doing his best and I was doing my best.
      “I don’t want to crash with anyone, but that was it. I tried to do my best with the amount of conversation I had. One-way conversation obviously as I wasn’t talking too much back.
      “There was a lot of traffic coming to me, but I was still trying to do my best to pass the guy in front.”

      Vettel did what Webber couldnt do in silverstone he made the moves stick and overtook him.

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      1. McLaren78 says:

        I’m talking about Vettel and all this stuff about ‘3 world titles’, ‘one of the greats’, ‘on of the top 10 ever’, etc. Not talking about Webber mate.

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      2. Aaron Noronha says:

        Check out all the rest in that list, they have done something similar that makes them multiple champions. He just joined an illustrated list of people. Ayrton Senna and Michael Schumacher, Alonzo(remember him blocking Hamilton during qualification when they were team mates) and many more.

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    3. Chooky says:

      Exactly!

      Thank goodness some have insight.
      I do hope this will change the dynamic throughout RBR (from the top). Vettel may be a good driver but how about being a team player?

      The boy needs discipline.

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      1. shankar says:

        +1!!!!
        Tired of hearing ruthless wins championships and records.

        i think hakkinen, raikonen etc. have more real racing fans.

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    4. HRC says:

      ++++++

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    5. Timmay says:

      That is the best summary of what happened at Sepang. I didn’t think Vettel could go any lower is my books, but she found a way.

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    6. I know says:

      You clearly did not see the race. Webber had not turned the engine down by the time Vettel made his pass stick – Webber (and Vettel) had both set their fastest laps of the race at that point, and they had been racing wheel to wheel for over a lap. Vettel clearly put his own interest over those of the team, but it was a fair fight.

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    7. John says:

      Horner confirmed they were both on the same engine setting you’re clutching at straw.

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    8. Matt says:

      …and in the laps immediately after the “move Mark over, he’s too slow” message, Mark pulled out a couple of seconds; Seb couldn’t go with him, and wound up with Lewis for company.

      Petulant.

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    9. Max Smoot says:

      Horner must be wondering who really runs his team.

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      1. God knows he doesnt.

        Its no longer RBR its SVR

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  22. Mr Squiggle says:

    RedBull management need to assert their authority here:

    1) Vettel should be stood down by RB for one race. He needs to be reminded of what has got him three world campoinships.

    Don’t turn up to Shanghai, Seb. RB should run one a TR driver in his place.

    2) Mark should be told to forfeit all of his earnings for this race. Standing on the podium at an F1 race is an honour, not a political platform and he should not have said what he said about internal team decisions.

    At the moment this whole sport is about managing tyres, engines, fuel loades etc. its more of a team sport than ever

    Seb needs to be put back in his box. Webber needs to be encouraged to stay in his.

    The race? o I loved it.

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    1. Xbox 720 says:

      Stood down? are you for real? you stand Vettel down for a race they lose the drivers title, Seb has done more for the team than Webber could ever do, if it was the other way round there would be an uproar, you can discredit Seb all you like but face it he’s better than Mark and he’s better than Hamilton, mind you even Nico is better than Hmailton.

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      1. cos says:

        @ xbox720 …are you for real? You think losing the WDC is the only reason they won’t ask Seb to forgoe racing in China….I think the real reason is that they will lose points in the Constructors Championship…hence the whole team orders thing. Also, lets not forget he may be able to drive the car, but its well known in the pit lane that the RedBull has been the best car in the paddock the last few years…so I’d say the x3 world championships are as much about the car and the team behind the scenes as the driver.

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      2. Tim P says:

        Xbox 720 I think that you should go back to playing games and leave this column to the true fans of this incredible sport that have an understanding of how it works. Seb disobeyed a clear and direct team order and did not fairly “race” Mark due to the fact that Mark had turned down his motor and was conserving tyres as directed by his team, Mark told it how it was and for that I have respect. What would have happened if Mark had of disobeyed team orders and kept pushing before Seb had the chance to close the gap we will never know. As it sits Seb was wrong and I hope both the team and him have learned from this.

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    2. HRC says:

      What a great chance to see what Torro Rosso can do with a world chumpian driver in the car for one race.

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    3. absolude says:

      Wow, I hope you are kidding.

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  23. Dude says:

    The amount of times Webber has had to sit behind Vettel and hold station in a very close 2nd spot (i can count a few times in 2010)…and it doesn’t happen one of the very few times Webber is in front of Vettel really says a few things.

    To stop this from ever happening again, Red Bull need to revert to the KERS, gearbox penalty, diff, start problem, drs failure, alternator thing they do to keep him away from Vettel!

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    1. Sebee says:

      At least they let them race. Look to Ferrari last 3 year to see the other was it could play out.

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  24. Leo says:

    [mod] Webber did a better job and won, Seb could not handle it. Marko is working against webber, what a shame. Mark drove a great race, only to be cheated to a win by a team that only favours one driver.
    Rosberg followed orders today but not Seb Oh No.
    He may well turn out to be another “greatest driver” but with no respect from others. Very disappointing !

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    1. absolude says:

      He would have won only with the help of team orders. He also didn’t obey orders in the past.

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  25. James says:

    An incident that stemmd from poor RB strategy earlier in the race. At the time of the ‘he’s too slow’ comment, Vettel & Webber were on different strategies and their inaction backed Vettel up to and ultimately behind Hamilton.

    With regards Webbers indignation, he was very vocal after the 2011 British GP about he much he disagreed with team orders and happily announced he had ignored “4 or 5 calls” to hold station. Funny that he now finds Vettel ignoring team orders so disappointing.

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    1. johny bravo says:

      Webber came as close as 1s to the Vettel in that race in 2011 – you believe is the same, like taking away somebody’s deserved win? .

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    2. splinky says:

      BINGO !!!

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    3. Sam says:

      Funny how Webber was able to pull away from Vettel over the next laps despite being “too slow”. Spoiled child couldn’t handle that he was beaten fair and square once again by his underrated team mate.

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  26. blackmamba says:

    I have never been so disgusted watching a F1 race before as I was today hearing the disdain in Vettel’s voice as he said to the team ‘he is too slow, get him out of the way’ meaning Webber. I felt so bad and angry for him with the sense of entitlement Vettel showed and then he pulls that dirty trick of attacking Webber when he had been assured twice that the race was over and the engines had been turned down. Badly done Vettel. Badly done!

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    1. brendan says:

      if lewis had been right behind vettel and may of lost a place to him,yes let him pass.
      but lewis wasnt much off a danger,
      i bet webber so am not happy,but i feel for webber,its like vettel has done it all sly.
      he even stood on his car saying number one.
      (that was well rubbing it in more)
      ok we know vettel is fast and is number one,

      what would of happened is vettel would of caused them both to crash?
      vettel was determind to get past.
      maybe be has got a little to big for his boots.
      he was lucky webber didnt hit it after.

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  27. Andrew says:

    Disgusting from vettel, tainted victory. Lack of class.

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    1. Sebee says:

      Vettel is DOTD!

      Today it stands for Don’t Obey Team Directions. :-)

      I hope F1 fans stand up and respect the ruthlessness of a 3X WDC winning machine, instead of giving another driver sympathy DOTD vote.

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      1. Timmay says:

        I am starting to suspect that you ARE Sebastian Vettel.

        If you are, I don’t like you.

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      2. Sebee says:

        I am not him.

        He wins GPs. I watch GPs.

        You can like me once again. :-)

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    2. zx6dude says:

      +1

      And people say he is not arrogant!

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    3. Chooky says:

      Absolutely, 100% correct!

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  28. After Marko saw the drama unfolding on the rostrum he must have nailed Vettel down and shoved a quickly composed apology in his hand to try and defuse the situation, Vettal couldn’t have cared less, he wasn’t about to follow a ‘number 2 driver home’ !!

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  29. David Plews says:

    a very hollow win :(

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  30. F*ckYeah says:

    Ant Davidson showed very nicely how Webber could have closed Seb off, but did not…

    Classy act from Merc, Rosberg and Hamilton showing how to do it right. At the moment they seem close to RBR, the disharmony there can only be to Mercedes drivers advantage.

    No doubt this page and others will be full of indignant posters raving about Team orders, but, what Red Bull and more successfully Merc did, was less than Alonso expects Massa to do for him at every race, why should his rivals fight him with one hand tied behind their backs ?

    Interesting too to see him getting so rattled at mention of Felipe outqualifying him for the last 4 races in a row. It will be a fun buildup to the next race, hopefully as many people as possible will bring this up and also highlight Felipe being ahead on points now :)

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    1. Simmo says:

      “Ant Davidson showed very nicely how Webber could have closed Seb off, but did not…”

      I didn’t see that, but it just shows how Webber is a team player.

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      1. brendan says:

        i saw it, he could of turned in a few times.
        vettel knows the tyres might not last, so i dont know what he was playing at.

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    2. Anne says:

      The way I see it Felipe wasted his big chance to make a statement today. He had a bad start and then all he could do was to finish in P5. He can´t blame neither the car nor his team mate for that.

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      1. Timmay says:

        True

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      2. hero_was_senna says:

        I agree, in addition, do you think Alonso would have finished behind Massa if it hadn’t been for his misfortune? I don’t

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      3. Anne says:

        I agree with you. Alonso was in P2 while Massa was in P7 right after the start. However I´m not sure Alonso would have won. 2 RB and 2 Mercedes is too much to handle. If I´m not mistaken Ferrari will bring upgrades to China. Alonso needs China. He is 22 points behind Vettel

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      4. Elie says:

        Bahahaha.. “Misfortune”.. seriously open your eyes he made an error and paid a price.. You know every driver acknowledges it from time to time not this “hero” ..

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      5. hero_was_senna says:

        Bearing in mind Anne that the two rb’s and the Mercs were behind Alonso in Australia

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    3. I know says:

      “Classy act from Merc, Rosberg and Hamilton showing how to do it right.”

      It was probably the smart thing to do, but team orders are hardly “classy”.

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  31. azlie says:

    I would think that the Hamilton/Rosberg situation is a much more controversial thing than Vettel/Webber. At least they were racing!

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    1. Sebee says:

      Yes!!!

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    2. F1 Bobby says:

      Ham and Ros swapped places a number of times before they were instructed held station. The controversy stems from Vettel ignoring team orders not team orders per se (which are part and parcel of F1).

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    3. zx6dude says:

      If you consider racing when your team mate turned down the car to conserve tyres and car…

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    4. jeffwest says:

      Why? Team orders are allowed in F1. Not taking instructions in a team effort betray the time-honoured understanding of sportsman-like behaviour. You wouldn’t happen to be a Vettel fan by any chance?

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    5. Yak says:

      Agreed. In Red Bull’s case it was a matter of both drivers being told to ease up and just take the 1-2 as it stood. If both were allowed to race and didn’t have to worry about the tyres, you couldn’t really say for sure who would have crossed the line first.

      In Merc’s case, Rosberg clearly could have had Hamilton, but for whatever reason was told to hold back. It didn’t have to be a tough battle like Vettel and Webber, he could easily have taken him down one of the big straights even without Hamilton letting him past (although from the sounds of what Hamilton has said, he would have let it happen). A quick pass down the straight and then just hold formation to the end. Right near the end of the race we saw from Rosberg’s T-cam going into turn one, and you could see how slow they were crawling around the track. Seemed almost to the extent that Rosberg wasn’t even braking into turn one, just lifting off and letting the drag eventually slow the car.

      My guess is that maybe Merc felt it would look better for them if Hamilton scored his first podium for the team. New improved car, new management, new big name champion driver in the seat… look what we’re achieving now. But if that’s the case, when even Hamilton is on the podium saying Rosberg deserved that spot, I don’t think it’s really worked out.

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  32. The Finger says:

    Brilliant!!! Thoroughly enjoyable!!!

    There’ll be a lot of Anti-Vettel jumping on the bandwagon but, in my opinion, he only did wrong in terms of his team. In terms of the spirit of racing and the spirit of F1 he was brilliant! How boring it would have been if he had stayed behind, like Nico with Lewis.

    Webber was so slow in the middle of the race that he nearly compromised Vettel’s race, and actually led to Vettel coming out behind Lewis after one set of stops. Webber also isn’t the goody-two-shoes he makes himself out to be, forcing Vettel dangerously close to the wall at the start of the overtake.

    It was all great to watch, and Vettel did what he was paid to do: RACE!!!

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    1. Robin says:

      Indeed. You could argue if he had it would have been a disaster for the sport as you have four cars finishing in obvious formation, the sort of thing that turns casual fans off. As it is, this race result just made the front of the Globe and Mail’s website, a Canadian paper that rarely gives any prominence to F1.

      This is the biggest thing since Danica Patrick.

      Robin

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    2. Simmo says:

      “Webber also isn’t the goody-two-shoes he makes himself out to be, forcing Vettel dangerously close to the wall at the start of the overtake.”

      I’m pretty sure Webber was well ahead when he chose his line, and Vettel just wanted the inside of the track.

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      1. brendan says:

        vettel is so lucky webber didnt put him in the wall.

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      2. Lol says:

        Lol, get real. It was Schumi-Rubens all over.

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      3. Simmo says:

        Firstly, telling me to “get real” is quite offensive, so if that could be moderated in the future James…

        Now, more importantly, after very carefully watching the replay over, I can confirm that Webber only moved while Vettel was behind him. As soon as Vettel got along side him, Mark stopped moving over. And there was plenty of room, for 1 car.

        Proof is at http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01rjzh7/Formula_1_2013_The_Malaysian_Grand_Prix_Highlights/ watch 1:19:35. Apologies for the large link.

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      4. Siobhan says:

        Gary Anderson says different.

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      5. Simmo says:

        So? Gary Anderson has his views, which I’m not saying are bad, but he may be wrong…

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    3. Miha Bevc says:

      True.

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    4. JC says:

      Tend to agree, but the key moment was switching to slicks too early and getting on traffic effectively giving away his advantage to MW. From then on an uphill battle. Obviously he though that deserved the win (or fight for it) after following MW from 2-3 secs to save tyre wear throughout the race and compromising his position to Lewis.
      Ferrari would have handled it differently as they did in Australia …

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    5. Aaron says:

      Webber never moved right, he just held his line. Vettel chose to go right into the narrow gap between Webber and the wall. The move was only dangerous because he chose to dive into the gap.

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      1. mhilgtx says:

        Maybe you should re watch that pass, that is not my recollection.

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    6. web head says:

      It would have been an even fight if Webber had the same engine performance and not turned down to what, multi 21 as stated. Poor form on vettel, no wonder why people dislike him with a passion. It shows how arrogant vettel is and how he disregards all the team and factory personnel

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    7. Symo says:

      Webber was managing the tyres when Vettel said he was too slow, BUT just after Vettel said he was slow Webber started smashing him sector after sector and pulled out a 4s+ lead!

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  33. wakie81 says:

    I’d respect Seb more if he came out and said I know what I did and I’d do it again instead of I didn’t ignore the orders on purpose.

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    1. Craig in Manila says:

      Agreed.

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    2. Grant H says:

      Agree these guys are racing drivers the job is to win, that’s it. Team orders are pants. Don’t believe the apology

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  34. Nick says:

    Another typical move from the[mod] spoiled brat of Formula 1

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  35. Pete_from_Nepal says:

    Not sure what to think of Vettel the driver yet. Disobeying team orders is fair enough, sometimes. The team doesn’t necessarily have your best interest at heart all the time (like Barichello and team orders). But I think when the other driver is told that there would be no threat, just to go outright and take the win is not right.

    Of course F1 doesn’t revolve around ethics. It revolves around money – and so points. Other World champions have been similarly ‘unethical’, and this is just to prove that SV is in that league I suppose. Perhaps it shows one of the many reasons Rosberg and SV are in different leagues.

    Still, I am disappointed in some ways. Mika Hakkinen always struck me as a gentleman (I can’t remember any controversies but I could be wrong) and it was always a joy to see him race. Perhaps after this incident I will find Mika’s wins more worthy knowing that his victories were due to hard work and skills, and not necessarily also because of some backstabbing…

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    1. JubJub says:

      Listen to Martin Brundle during the wrap up section after the race. He has a rather interesting view on team orders and Mika Hakkinen.

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      1. Pete_from_Nepal says:

        Thanks JJ, would love to watch. Do you have a link?

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    2. Chris says:

      DC gifted Mika a win in 97 I believe.

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    3. Aaron Noronha says:

      At the last race of the 1997 season in Jerez, Coulthard was obliged by team orders to concede second place to Häkkinen with three laps to go. Villeneuve needed to finish the race to win that year’s drivers’ championship in a car which was underperforming following a lap 48 collision with Schumacher. He gave way to the two McLarens on the final lap, with Coulthard reported to be “not bubbling with joy after the event… Häkkinen himself was speechless and made little sense after the race.”[14]

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      1. Aaron Noronha says:

        At the last race of the 1997 season in Jerez, Coulthard was obliged by team orders to concede second place to Häkkinen with three laps to go. Villeneuve needed to finish the race to win that year’s drivers’ championship in a car which was underperforming following a lap 48 collision with Schumacher. He gave way to the two McLarens on the final lap, with Coulthard reported to be “not bubbling with joy after the event… Häkkinen himself was speechless and made little sense after the race.”

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      2. Pete_from_Nepal says:

        You’re right. Also realized happened again in 1998 Melbourne under very strange circumstances (although I think there was a gentleman’s agreement in place for this one) and someone allegedly broke into the McLaren communication system.

        Sigh. perhaps I am all wrong then. This is all a show, and a drama for the total master puppeteer and ringmaster Bern. E.

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    4. shankar says:

      +1 exactly what i was thinking

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    5. cos says:

      +1… not sure how much he meant it, but Schumi has been well quoted as saying the one man he respected / feared most on the track was Mika

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    6. Timmay says:

      Mikas first 2 wins weren’t down to hard work or skills – DC pulled over for both of them. So watch those ones, Jerez 97 & Melbourne 98.

      Point taken that he was a gentleman and very fast though.

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    7. Jeff says:

      Yes, Nico and SV are in different leagues. Both are very fast, skilled drivers. Nico, like Hamilton, has class. SV has none.

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  36. amal says:

    Webber,man of the day ??

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    1. Lol says:

      He lost while getting the better strategy calls and showed himself to be a hypocrite. So no.

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  37. Miha Bevc says:

    Well, this was another thrilling race, which makes it 2 out of 2.

    Vettel sure did wrong to ignore team orders, but you have to admire his hunger for winning. People who are against team orders won’t complain I guess. This is probably why Alonso and Vettel are multiple champions, while Webber and Massa aren’t. Can someone imagine Alonso apologizing for overtaking Massa? Schumacher for overtaking Barichello? Senna for overtaking Prost (and vice-versa)? Boy F1 has changed! But at least we have something to chew on.

    Alonso arguably did no mistakes in 2012, but now he did 2 in 1 lap. Bad call not to pit!

    Kimi was nowhere today, despite having one stop less. I hope Lotus will be back in China.

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    1. Miha Bevc says:

      Just read it was team decision not to pit Alonso so only one and a half mistake by Alonso :) He should have insisted…

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      1. Valois says:

        I have just read the opposite: That Alonso made the call to stay for more 3 ou 4 spins. Maybe we’ll never know the truth.

        By the way, if Alonso really decided to stay in track he may be becoming desperate because of

        1) track was clearly very wet at first sector and it would take a great deal of laps to dry; and

        2) front wing did not lose just one appendix, it was clear that it would detach soon. We have already seen that kind of damage before and its consequences (wing becomes loose and gets stuck behind the car).

        Let China come.

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      2. brendan says:

        alonso was waiting for the track to dry so he could put slicks on and not lose that much time.
        alonso could of caused a pile up,was to dangerous to stay out.

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      3. Anne says:

        It doesn´t matter what Alonso wanted. The team has a safety responssibility to order him to pit despite his wishes to stay

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      4. greetz says:

        indeed he did not intend to pit, he drove full power with that flappy front wing.

        from the tv footage I don’t get why Ferrari is not penalized for alowing this dangerous situation to happen

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      5. Yak says:

        Alonso can make calls about the choice of tyres, but something like a front wing half hanging off the car is more for the pit lane to call on. They’re the ones with the data and the footage of the car’s condition. Alonso was in no real position to make a call on the integrity of the front wing beyond whether or not it was making the car undriveable.

        That they gave Alonso an option might have suggested to him that it wasn’t a huge DNF risk to keep going until they were ready to come off the inters. After all, surely if the team had a real concern they would have told him to pit, not asked if he wanted to.

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    2. [MISTER] says:

      Vettel only apologized after the team told him to do it. I didn’t see Vettel putting his hands up and trying to talk Mark in the room before the podium.

      Apologizing after was just for the media sake and to save something out of it. Saying he didn’t know about it is bull.

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  38. Formula Zero says:

    What a race! Malaysian grand prix was equally entertaining, controversial & heart aching. No question, Vettel is one of the best drivers going around, but he is neither a team player nor manageable. He falls into the same category as Senna & Schumacher is one way, they all want to win at all cost. Webber could’ve gone faster, but he didn’t because he was promised the win & turned the engine down. At this rate Vettel is not going to have many friends left in the sport, certainly not many fans. Webber is people’s winner.

    As far as Rosberg’s race was concerned, I can’t help to feel sorry for him. From the beginning of the season I backed Rosberg to have the upper hand over Hamilton & I still do. I am sure if the circumstances are equal for both drivers, Nico will beat Lewis fair & square in qualifying and the race. But both drivers showed outstanding respect to each other. That is how team mates should behave on and off the track. Red Bull can take some lesson from that.

    What happened to Ferrari’s pace James? Great job by Massa though. He has beaten his superstar team mate again & very fairly. Hopefully drivers like Massa & Webber get some rewards for not just because they are great drivers but also because they are good sport. I am sure we will be hearing a lot about Webber/Vettel & Rosberg/Hamilton story. But I gotta say, “Bianchi deserves a championship fighting car”. If he can finish 13th for a super slow car, imagine what he can do in Force India, not to mention the Big 5 (Red Bull, Ferrari, Mercedes, Renault & McLaren).

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    1. Andrew M says:

      How were circumstances between Hamilton and Rosberg not “fair and square” in either qualifying session, or the race in Melbourne?

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      1. Formula Zero says:

        Lewis did nothing wrong mate. But Nico had too much technical issues in Melbourne which affected his qualifying & race. He was fastest in most part of the qualifying & practice. And you know about Malaysia already. Again I command Lewis’s sportsmanship. But Nico has the upper hand in my book in terms of tyre management & pace.

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    2. hero_was_senna says:

      Ferrari’s race pace ended at the start of lap 2!
      Even with major damage to the Ferrari, Webber wasn’t getting past.
      As to beating his team-mate fairly, what are you on? Alonso was ahead before the first corner.

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    3. Max Smoot says:

      Bianchi performances excellent so far. Let’s see the view from his camera once in awhile.

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    4. krischar says:

      Great job by massa ?

      Started P2 and Finished P5

      Alonso is not a superstar in brazil or England. He is a legend and superstar in our hearts though

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  39. Thembekile says:

    James what do you think of Lewis’s switch to Mercedes when looking at how well he seems to have adapted there?

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    1. Dave C says:

      He’s adapted just fine, with Ross assuring him the faster Nico Rosberg wouldn’t be challenging him and damage his reputation, it’s a farce what a stab in the back for Nico after years of playing 2nd fiddle to Schumacher yet he was the faster driver, same all over again but with 1 step further and openly not allowed to pass a slower driver, but I know and most analysts knows that Nico is faster than Hamilton, hard to swallow but I’m glad Vettel showed Webber who the champion is.

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      1. Marcelo Leal says:

        I’m sure you watched the race, and so you know that Rosberg did try to pass Hamilton twice and Hamilton did gain the position on both ocasions.

        As everybody else, I think Rosberg could get past eventually, but we are not so sure as Rosberg was asking for Brawn to give order to Lewis to let him through. And that was the “negative, negative” answer from Ross.

        With Rosberg driving so close to Hamilton and losing downforce, we are not sure he would get past. And maybe he was trying to do exactly what Vettel did.

        He asked Brawn to easy things for him as Lewis was regaining the position. As I said, we have some evidences to think one way, but you cannot be so sure as to get pas is not so easy, and thinking about Hamilton and the circuit, can be really difficult. Webber even controlling the pace, did let Vettel pass or we dont know if Vettel would do it.

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      2. Yak says:

        I don’t think Nico was asking for Lewis to let him past. He was asking for permission to overtake Lewis, i.e. abandon the order to slow down and sit behind Lewis.

        They were taking it very easy towards the end as Lewis had pushed it too hard chasing the Red Bulls. Nico had paced himself better and at the end felt he was very much being held up. Lewis seems to agree.

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      3. I will says:

        Dave, are German?

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      4. Newman says:

        Where did you get that idea from? Schumacher and Rosberg were free to race eachother unless conditions warrented team orders. I don’t remember them crashing into eachother too which is a bonus.

        I still remember Suzuka 2011 when Schumi was significantly faster than Rosberg, on fresher tyres and Rosberg not yielding. Both had a high 7th gear and Schumi couldn’t get past. The fact that Rosberg did his own thing kind of destroys your “second fiddle” theory, doesn’t it?

        There’s a ton of difference between having a team leader and a “number 1” driver.

        Anyway, let’s hope today was one of those special days where the much faster driver was not allowed to pass.

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      5. Val from montreal says:

        Dave , with all due respect to you but , how and when was Rosberg playin 2nd fiddle to Schumacher these last 3 years ??

        Are u talking about the number swapping # 7 on Michael’s car ? I think thats the only thing that Schuey asked for when he arrived at Mercedes , and it was’nt an issue for Nico because he agreed to it …

        Rosberg faster than him ? Maybe a bit in 2010 and beginning 2011 but afterwards not really , especially throughout 2012 … Brawn had to make it clear to the media from the get-go that MSC and Nico would be on equal terms ….

        Peace

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    2. Sikhumbuzo says:

      @ Thembi

      Well Sisi if anything credit should go to Bob Bell and Aldo Costa in particular. This new Mercedes car has the potential to challenge the Bulls. I think it’s a touch above the Ferrari and visibly looks easy to drive. China should be more indicative.

      Sikhumbuzo

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  40. Quade says:

    Todays race ended with ugly team orders.
    I felt sorry for Rosberg today. It seems that he might have to begin gearing up to be number two. He and Lewis handled it quite well, but will it change thing? “Negative!” :)

    As for Red Bull, its going to be a season of fireworks and full on warfare.

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    1. shankar says:

      no i think webber will accept what he is supposed to be in that team and quieten down as he has done for the past years with almost all failures and electronic clutch start problems kept coming to him again and again and again.

      and i think it is disappointing that mark doesn’t stand up and make his mark.

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  41. Johnny Canuck says:

    What an extraordinary thing for Vettel to do. He seemed to indicate post-race that he was unaware of the instruction to him to keep station (which Weber apparently thought laughable). Can those who were monitoring Red Bull pit communications comment on whether Vettel seemed to be in normal communication with his team in the latter stages of the race? When he and Webber met prior to the podium celebration and Webber repeated the team’s code for keeping station, Vettel didn’t respond that I could notice. One might think that if he’d had radio problems and didn’t hear the message, he would have said something to that effect or asked Webber what he was on about. If there was some sort of radio problem, it would at least make his actions defensible.

    My own suspicion is that he figured (and last year confirmed) that every point is important and he was going to get maximum points today come heck or high water, team orders be damned. Perhaps as World Champion he thought he was due the points regardless of whether Webber was running ahead of him. How many Ferrari drivers had to move over for Schumacher? And certainly other teams have made similar moves.

    Whatever the reasons, Vettel has certainly thrown a major grenade into the team. Will he and Webber both last out the season at Red Bull? Vettel obviously delivers results …… will that be more important to the team going forward than trust? An interesting season in the offing …….

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    1. Robin says:

      They survived Turkey 2010, they’ll survive this.

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    2. brendan says:

      vettel heard all the messages,he even said i heard the order to stay behind, but in my mind i didnt listern.
      standing on his car waving number one, was just rubbing salt in the wound.
      i used to like vettel alot,after what he has done not sportmanship.
      like webber said nothing will be done because he is the golden boy.

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  42. All revved-up says:

    If Nico didn’t have to save fuel, and yet held station to Hamilton; then Vettel surely ought to have done the same.

    I do understand that saving engines to make the 8 engines last the long season ahead means taking a long term strategic view on team management.

    But the importance of these strategic season long issues notwithstanding, it does result in races that seem just a little unsatisfactory to an F1 fan out to enjoy a day of exciting racing.

    There’s was little excitement in seeing Weber turn down his engine, only to be passed by Vettel; nor Rosberg arguing with Ross Brawn about whether he may or may not pass Hamilton.

    Actually the last 10 laps felt like a soap opera, than an F1 race. And the mood on the podium, what a joy killer at the end of a long day out for F1 fans.

    If we want to watch 4 grumpy people, we don’t tune into an F1 race to do so.

    Someone milking the F1 franchise had better earn their overblown incomes and sort this matter out pronto. Pah!

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    1. Aaron Noronha says:

      there was no way Webbers Engine was toned down if it were Vettels car would have been a car length at the end of the straight before the braking point. He was expecting the move and watching his mirrors from when he had emerged from the pits, watch the reply carefully. He know what Vettel was doing it takes only a fraction of a second to turn the engine back up. And he did the same thing Webber did to him in silverstone, read the above comments

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    2. brendan says:

      i have said before bring back refueling and one chose of tyre ,and one engine for each race.
      there be no need for team orders then to save fuel,engines and tyres.
      the fasted car/driver would always in.

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  43. Mohan says:

    A straightforward attitude to disobey team orders is understandable as ‘determination’ to become a world champion. When one conserves fuel by turning down the engine as part of a team strategy and the other later capitalizes on it, it is backstabbing on your teammate.

    Shame on you Vettel.

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  44. JRay says:

    Right or wrong I think Vettel has diminished himself today…Webber should leave a soon as possible.

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    1. Lol says:

      In fact, Vettel has now claimed to be the true follow up of Senna.

      All these people complaining are new to F1 or just hate Vettel.

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  45. Alberto Martínez says:

    James,

    You rate Felipe Massa´s race as an ‘strong performance’ when he was losing time with Button in an struggling McLaren and both in a 3 stop strategy but I only can see it the other way around.

    I think Massa should have closed mouths today and prove the great driver he is in a day in which Alonso had an DNF, but didn´t happen. Today he can´t blame Ferrari strategy or conspirations inside the team against him.
    In my view Massa has returned to great form in qualifying but not in race trim – we´ll never know what Alonso could have done today in the same car: podium?

    Would like to know people´s reactions to Mercedes controversy if would have happened in the Ferrari garage with Alonso in the role of Hamilton and Massa in the role of Rosberg. Same yardstick?

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    1. Truth or Lies says:

      You’d have to say Massa faded in the early part of the race, but for sure he was held up by Alonso when he ran into Vettel at turn 2 and that allowed a number of cars past on either side.

      But no doubt the Ferrari in Massa’s hand appeared to struggle in the mixed conditions, but we’ll never know what Fernando would have done as he was already out at that stage. All I can say is that in the past 5 or 6 races both Ferrari drivers have been pretty evenly matched, wet or dry.

      Massa was also hampered just like Vettel when they both pitted one lap too soon for slicks. However I thought in the dry and warmer final 1/3 of the race he was strong. These conditions seemed to suit the Ferrari better and after his final stop came back very strongly overtaking Perez and both Lotus’s to take 5th. So in fairness while not brilliant, it surely wasn’t that bad either and keeps both him and Ferrari in decent championship positions.

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      1. Multi 21 says:

        Having watched replays of Massa’s start I’d say it was mostly his own fault. When he arrived at turn 1 he chose neither the inside or outside lines. He just drifted around the middle of the track largely in Alonso’s wake.

        This let Webber take the inside and Hamilton take the outside. When Alonso was baulked by Vettel at T2, he had nowhere to go and had to lift allowing Webber and Hamilton to get a better run out of turn 2.

        He was then squabbling with Rosberg at T4 which allowed Button to pass and demoted FM to 6th after lap 1. Podium chance over in four corners.

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    2. Abdul says:

      I totally agree with you. Massa has improved his qualm, but race pace is yet to be omfirmed.

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      1. Abdul says:

        Sorry should say qualy

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    3. [MISTER] says:

      Agree with you completely.

      I think we would have never heard the end of it if it was the Ferrari boys instead of Mercedes.

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    4. David Ryan says:

      Massa was on a 4-stop strategy, so the comparison doesn’t quite bear out. His first lap wasn’t very impressive, that much is true, but thereafter he was on the pace for the most part, set the 2nd fastest lap and made the most of his new tyres at the end. Pat Fry said in the post-race quotes that Massa “definitely drove a good race” so if Ferrari themselves believe he did well I’d say that settles it. How Alonso would have done became rather a moot point once he ran into the back of Vettel in turn 2…

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    5. Timmay says:

      I think if Alonso were driving the same car as Massa today she would have broken her front wing on lap 1 and slid into a sandtrap at the start of lap 2 after choosing not to go to the pits for some arrogant reason.

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  46. Rick says:

    It appears that Mercedes grossly underestimated the fuel load necessary to compete for the full distance. What if they were in a position to win? How stupid would that have been, not to be able to drive fast enough because they’re conserving fuel.

    Did they expect rain, when no one else did? Did they need that weight-saving so badly in order to protect their tires that they compromised their potential speed?

    Really, it makes them look pretty stupid or desperate, either way.

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    1. Andy says:

      It seems ironic that F1 followers lambast Pirelli for producing tyres that the FIA have requested, and prevent drivers ‘from driving flat out’, and yet at every race we hear a team telling a driver to save fuel because they have deliberately underfuelled him.

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    2. Simmo says:

      Not really, seeing as it was only an issue on Hamilton’s car, not Rosberg’s

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      1. Tom Johnson says:

        Hamilton was fighting the RBs for the win Rosburg wasn’t and had no chance of doing so had he overtaken Hamilton. Mercedes need to get a grip on how Hamilton races, the days of Schumacher/Rosberg scraping along for a few points are over this is Hamilton we’re talking about and he’s always going to be competing with the race leaders. Now that is an experience Mercedes is going to have to get used to. Hold on to your hats boys!

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      2. Simmo says:

        That’s true, I’ve changed my mind :)

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      3. Newman says:

        Or Hamilton used up too much fuel to fight with the Red Bulls (or keep the faster Rosberg behind him)

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      4. Poyta says:

        Who’s to say it wasn’t an issue on Rosberg;s car? only Brawn would be privy to that information and you as a viewer aren’t.

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      5. Simmo says:

        Fair enough :)

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  47. Wayne says:

    Just to say I do and have always agreed with team orders at the point that it is sensible to do so both in the race and in the championship. F1 is a TEAM sport, it’s both a very simple and strightforward concept. In this race both Merc and RBR let the drivers race until the last few laps and then called them off to maximise the team points haul. Who in their right mind would have a problem with that from a fan perspective? Teams invest millions and receive millions for their constructors position, it’s genuinely important for their future – the money pays the bills to keep the lights on.

    ROS could have passed HAM and was faster but did the right thing and obeyed his employer, the people who give him the car and pay his wages. He did not risk his position or HAMs. HAM should be prepared to do exactly the same thing next time the positions are reversed and if he does not I would think less of him. And I don’t doubt that Brawn will give that order if needs be. They (ROS and Brawn) are both men of honor.

    VET did the complete opposite. Now, people will defend him with the tired old tosh about ‘he’s a racing driver, you can’t blame him’ – but that’s just rubbish. If you have an agreement you don’t get to back out of it when it suits you. You also don’t get to ignore your employer when it suits you. Apologising after the fact means very little when you have the points in the bag. VET will never get the
    credit he genuinly deserves for his drives until he A) moves to a new team. B) Races a team-mate of ALO and HAMs calibre (Not to take anything away from WEB who I genuinely respect perhaps more than any other driver) just as ALO
    directly raced HAM at McLaren. and C) cuts the childish, whinging and dishonorable behavior out of his game just as HAM (who was every bit as bad) now seems to have done.

    Mercedes should be proud of the decision they took and their both of their drivers’ reactions to it. RBR should be proud of
    the decision they took, WEB should be proud of his race. Only VET should be looking at himself – the fact that he has apologised suggests that he is. The problem now is that he has broken a trust – how is WEB supposed to trust that he will stick to the gareement next time? He won’t so he’ll keep racing and
    the tissuepaper tyres will wear out or they will collide.

    Know what though, I blame the tyres even more than I blame VET. If they were not all trundling around 1 second a lap slower than they otherwise would be to protect the tyres these situations would be much less likely to occur. Pirelli are utterly ruining F1 for me,
    I just don’t understand how any fan of RACING could disagree with me. They’re not racing on the track as they should be in the world’s
    premiere moreorsport formula, all the racing is being done in the strategy department! How can this possibly be the preferred situation for any F1 fan. It’s not a real situation, it’s engineered, it’s false and fascile and it’s making F1 superficial. Pirelli are the worst thing to happen to F1 in a long long time, we should bloody boycott their road tyres (whihc wouldn;t be a bad thing considering they might not last a trip to the
    supermarket 😉

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    1. Darren W says:

      The Pirelli indictment is a little strong. They have done exactly as the FIA asked…and done it well. Michelin on the other hand, did serious damage to F1’s reputation at Indianapolis in 2005.

      One of the exciting things about F1 is the engineering aspect. Everything is constantly being engineered; even the controversies.

      F1 engineered itself into a corner of processional racing and they have found a way to engineer (through tires, DRS, KERS) excitement back into the racing. To pick on the tires is a bit like choosing the chow mein over the fried rice…or any of the other thirty choices at the buffet.

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    2. IgMi says:

      I fully agree with you the view of the drivers’ and teams’ performance today. It was put together very nicely.

      However, I have to admit that I disagree with your view of the tires. I find that the uncertainty they introduce adds to the suspense as it requires additional skills from teams and drivers alike. The race is not just about going fast, is also about lasting the distance, not just from lap to lap in a single race, but also from race to race (I love the limits on engine allocation, gearbox changes, etc.) That being said, ROS could have performed even better if he backed off little bit more behind HAM to add to the preservation of his machinery for the races to follow – the season has just started.

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    3. Miha Bevc says:

      I agree that Pirelli tyres are a little bit too extreme this year. At a certain point of the race all cars from P1 to P14 were having the same pace

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      1. Miha Bevc says:

        Clearly, tyres are the limiting factor.

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      2. Jeff says:

        F1 is in danger of turning into NASCAR, where many drivers have the skill to go a certain pace, but the machinery and the racing format don’t allow the drivers with that extra 1% to shine, so there’s little to differentiate between the most skilful drivers.

        I liked the tyre format initially, but with 4 pit stops per race and so much ‘driving to a lap time’, it’s getting to become a bit of a joke.

        I want to see the top drivers have to drive on the ragged edge of adhesion to win, not to have the prize go to the most accurate driver who can lap to a particular time. That’s called a regularity rally, not Formula 1.

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      3. Very well put.. If you want to see this sort of rubbish go watch nascar.

        Me I am cant wait for the Le Mans 24 hour. F! lost me.

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      4. John says:

        Totally agree, f1 has changed in recent years due to tyres no longer are the drivers on the limit prob a reason why schumacher wasnt the same driver as its simply not about who is the quickest driver, all you hear is manage tyres,mind your pace, bring back fuel stops and tyres where degredation doesnt set in after a few laps, then we’ll see cars at full speed on th limit for duration of th race,and well not have to see any of ths managing fuel either..poor rosberg

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    4. franb says:

      +1. The tyres are the real story here and people are getting caught up in team orders. The sad truth is that the top 4 drivers were nursing their cars home for one reason or another. Mostly tyres. Why aren’t more people upset about that? Is this good racing. Say what you will about VET, but at least he was pushing at the end which is more than I can say about the rest of them. You want to protect the car. Pull into the garage and make way for people who want to race and go fast.

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    5. Cliff says:

      I suspect that we come from different sides of the argument on team orders and tyres, but I have to admit that you make a strong argument on both points. Nevertheless, the type of tyres being supplied by Pirelli were requested by F1 itself. Using your Supermarket, if you’re asked to go to a shop and buy a tin of white paint, you buy white paint. When you return home you’re then told “I wanted white paint, but not that shade of white paint”, that’s the problem Pirelli has, no-one in F1 actually knows what they want, although individual teams know exactly what they want!

      As for the team orders, Nico Rosberg could argue that it’s not his fault that Lewis was running out of fuel, so why should he be penalised? The team after all, would have got the same number of points! I do agree that Mercedes will quickly move on from today, who knows what will happen next at RBR?

      I did find it slightly amusing that both LH & SV apologised after bagging the ‘big points’, when it was all avoidable.

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    6. Kay says:

      Well said on all your points. +1

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    7. jph2812 says:

      i agree with everything you say and when you have more downforce on your car you chew the tyres up faster then i no longer get what the sport is trying to do

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    8. Andrew M says:

      I’m not sure about the worst thing that’s ever happened to F1, but I’m certainly no fan of the Pirelli philosophy. I watched the highlights of the 2003 race on Sky F1, and it’s amazing just how much more dynamic and on-edge the cars were on low fuel and tyres that didn’t fall off a cliff. It’s not exactly a co-incidence that the best non-wet races (for me at least) last year were Canada, Abu Dhabi and Austin, where the tyre choice was “conservative” and allowed the drivers to go flat out for the whole race distance.

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    9. JC says:

      For this kind of racing we have sports cars racing, Le Mans, etc. save fuel, tyres etc and have a tactical sprint every now and then. I like that, but IMO not what F1 should be…

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    10. simon says:

      +1 totally agree about the tyre situation, its getting to be more like the Pirelli show.

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    11. Jimbob says:

      +1.. Apart from the stuff about the tyres. F1 was pretty predictable pre Pirelli, I do prefer watching the drivers struggle a bit even if it does take some of the purity out of the sport.

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    12. hero_was_senna says:

      Was I watching a different race?
      Didn’t Rosberg overtake Hamilton a few times with DRS into the last corner, then get repassed down the following straight?
      It was only after this that Rosberg was told to hold station

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    13. John Marshall says:

      Agree 100%, only thing I’d add to the list is DRS. It’s phony and cheap. And, I’m tired of hearing announcers make a big deal out of passes that are completely predictable and require little to no skill to pull off.

      I’m much more impressed with Kimi or Lewis racing wheel to wheel with someone than I ever will be with a DRS pass.

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  48. Anne says:

    Vettel is insane.Give him a straight jacket. He won 3 championships, it was only the second race of the season. RELAX!!!

    Nice to see Hamilton back in McLaren for pit stop :)

    Ferrari what a mess!!! Both drivers made big mistakes. Unbelieveble!!! Oh well… better luck next time. The good news is they are no longer alone when it comes to team orders.

    I don´t have a problem with team orders. It is clear all teams have number 1 and number 2 driver. But why too early in the season? What a contrast between RB and Mercedes.

    Force India pit stops UUUHHHGGG!!! Bloody joke!

    Great battle and racing between Kimi and The Hulk :)

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    1. Mingojo says:

      Team orders is not new in Formula 1. All the teams have used it at some point, even the ones that have hypocritically denied it.

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      1. Anne says:

        I know. I don´t have a problem with that. Just not too early and no too blatant. Use pit stop strategy instead. Be blatant after midseason

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    2. brendan says:

      kimi makes me laugh he is so funny,
      hulkenberg was racing him,kimi went on the radio and said he is getting in my way putting me off,ha ha.
      i remember years ago when schumacher was getting an award of pele before a race,kimi was asked did you see it.kimi said no i was having a sh@t.
      and when he broke down at monaco years ago,he never went back to the pits,he went to his boat took his shirt off and had an ice cream.

      imagine if kimi was told to stay behind his team mate for 2nd.i think his answer to his team would of been @@@@@@@ bleep @@@@@ bleep :0)

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    3. Grant says:

      Oooh, the love story between Lewis and McLaren.
      So touching…

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    4. hero_was_senna says:

      Alonso made a big mistake. Massa just raced at his level as always..

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  49. Cozza says:

    I hope Webber repays the favor later in the year.

    or it lights a fire under him. Vettel clearly think there’s an I in team so Webber just goes for it. Screw Vettel, I’m going for a WDC.

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    1. Tutti says:

      Webber should shut it and remember Silverstone 2011 – going against team orders, playing the poor underdog card and being proud about it… Even being universally applauded for it. He failed to pass Vettel then, Vettel didn’t fail today. Which is expected… because Seb gets the job done.

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      1. Sebastian says:

        +1

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      2. **Paul** says:

        That’s all that needs saying about the move. Well put !

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      3. John says:

        +1 totally agree, Webber needs to take this beating like a man, oh 26 wins in just over 4 years at redbull, imagine if he repreats it in the next 12 years, scary thought, the british fans and media would be tearing the hair out.

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      4. Aden Fergus says:

        Or because Seb had his engine turned up and Mark didn’t,that might help too.

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      5. 69bhp says:

        agreed, Webber can’t have it both ways. Christian Horner has also revealed that Webber ignored team orders and tried to race Vettel in Brazil last year.

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    2. Poyta says:

      The difference with Webber in Silverstone 2011 is that both Sebastian and Webber said ” stuff order, lets give the viewers what they want to see and race” so it was an equal contest and race but in this situation how is it fair if one driver turns it down while the other turns it up to steal a win?

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  50. Scuderia McLaren says:

    What’s the big deal.

    Mark has done that before to Vettel. They were 2-3 at the 2011 British GP with Vettel leading and Horner saying hold station with a few laps left, but Webber ignored and challenged needlessly to the flag with Vettel holding on. Webber was praised for his racing courage to go against team orders, the “machine” and make Vettel earn it. Props Webbo…

    The issue here is that Vettel did EXACTLY the same thing, but beat Mark and showed him who was boss. Mark knew Vettel was challenging, clearly by almost putting Vettel in the wall, so he should stop crying. Stop being a hypocrite.

    Mark… If you are listening… You live by the sword you die by the sword. Or in Aussie, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

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    1. brendan says:

      mark wasnt 3 times world champion then was he?
      vettel knows he can beat webber anytime,so i guess its not the same,vettel had 6 wins before the british gp.
      webber just thought i wanna win one for a change.
      webber aint crying(there is a rule in the team so you dont crash in each other)
      if your ahead after the final pit stop and ahead of the 3rd,you dont race save the car.
      its even more important now due to tyre wear.

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    2. luqa says:

      Exactly!
      This was strictly about payback for Brazil 2012 when Webber cut Vettel off at the start of the race dropping him into the back markers, and then being spun around by Senna. That mostly and conveniently overlooked manoeuvre almost cost Vettel the Drivers Championship.
      What I find disingenuous is Vettel and RBR thinking an apology to Webber is necessary. Vettle was always faster today than Webber- even so far as to being backed into a charging Hamilton and Rosberg, resulting in coming out behind Hamilton after the pit stop . RBR blew the strategy calls by trying to appease Webber today and are thus in damage control mode.
      If they had done their job properly, we wouldn’t be having this artificial controversy. If I were Webber I’d be annoyed as well, but this is the big leagues, the pinnacle of motor sport not Formula Ford- get over it!

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    3. Greg (Aus) says:

      The difference is equal terms – Silverstone was not a case of Vettel being told to turn his engine down and coast home. This was not a fair contest, to claim otherwise is disingenuous.

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    4. JC says:

      Good view! What goes around comes around. Don’ t forget brazil start last year… He compromised Vettel’s position squeezing the inside line…

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    5. B.Diddy says:

      Difference was that 2011 was a totally dominat year for Seb and RBR Seb almost had the title sewn up with a huge lead over Webber. Absolutely no need for team orders from Horner then.
      Vetted has benefitted more from RBR policy to race until last pit stop.. If Webber had of done what Seb did today last season 2012 and taken a win away from him… Vettel would have lost the WDC to Alonso and be a double champ instead of triple champ….
      Today’s move lacked honour and class he is more than able to beat Webber in a straight fight as he has shown, do it don’t take cheap shots !!!! I’m not a Webber fan but feel very sorry for him today

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      1. Scuderia McLaren says:

        It’s not for Webber to judge when team orders were nessecary. The fact is they were given to him and he ignored and challenged and failed. He jeopardised results despite team orders a few times. Vett simply did the same and won. We can debate the difference as to whether team orders were needed at different times but the fact is they have been issued and ignored by Webber a few times and in critical moments as well. (Brazil 2012.)

        It’s in these moment quality rises. That Schumacher, Senna, Vettel, Hakkinen’s rise and the Barrichello, Coulthards and Webber’s fall.

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    6. Bellof says:

      well said !

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    7. hero_was_senna says:

      Hey Scud, from memory, had the RBR’s been told to turn down the engines at the end of the race, or were they still chasing Alonso till the end?

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  51. David S says:

    There is an interesting sub plot here that contrasts the ability of Christian Horner vs Ross Brawn.

    Ross was able to fully assert authority but Christian couldn’t. Inevitably this shows the respect Brawn has and can command. Mercedes need to take note of that moving forward and keep Ross on the payroll for that reason amongst many.

    Vettel disrespected his team boss…fact.

    We have a true Schumacher on our hands and I mean that in his inability to drive with grace and exhibit even a little fairmindedness in his behaviour.

    If he wants to polarise public opinion on his success he is going about it the right way…..webber won’t take this lying down and why on earth should he…it could turn red bulls championship in the wrong direction….

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    1. Andy says:

      I think that Vettel answers to Dr Marko, not Horner. Vettel wasn’t exactly the most popular driver before this race, his[mod] will do little to change this.

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    2. Phil H. says:

      Totally agree